Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Feb 19, 2024 12:48:05 GMT
Government institution does not equal government control. My belief is that the government tries very hard to control the BBC, and sometimes succeeds, sometimes fails. But I'd better not carry on with this or we'll be going way off-topic on missing doctor who episodes.
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Dec 25, 2023 9:49:04 GMT
I'm a bit late bumping this one to the top this year!
Merry Christmas, everybody!
Richard
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Nov 23, 2023 10:09:38 GMT
If the archive was looted before being destroyed (I wonder what they were after), then perhaps the Doctor Who episodes are in Turkey now, or in Northern Cyprus (BRT seems to be the northern Cyprus TV station).
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Nov 21, 2023 10:48:12 GMT
Did literally nothing get saved? I notice there is a new film archive now (https://www.limassol.org.cy/en/istoriko-arxeio-kentro-meleton) My understanding is that the archive in Limassol is focused on the historical records of the city of Limassol only and not the island as a whole. Paul It only occurred to me that if anything did survive, it might end up there. Richard
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Nov 20, 2023 16:22:57 GMT
Cause those 2 episodes (Episodes 4 and 5), along with some episodes of The Aztecs and The Sensorites, were stored in a vault in northern Nicosia, which was unfortunately destroyed in the Turkish invasion of Cyprus in 1974. The only reason the other episodes survived because they were in the main CyBC buildings in Southern Cyprus, where they escaped being touched by the Turks, since Turkey only focused on Northern Cyprus. This is incorrect. The building housing the Cyprus historical film archive, in which were several DW episodes was destroyed in the attempted coup that preceded the Turkish invasion. Did literally nothing get saved? I notice there is a new film archive now (https://www.limassol.org.cy/en/istoriko-arxeio-kentro-meleton) Richard
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Oct 12, 2023 10:24:34 GMT
I can't imagine the Jos station manager destroying WoF 3. I can imagine him taking it home and hiding it under the mattress. After all, no one is going to get a search warrant for your house on the basis of a film print and, you never know, maybe one day you might make some money out of it.
Or, even if all that logic didn't work for him, the safest thing to do would be for him to mislay it somewhere else within the TV station then pretend he knew nothing about it.
If you did destroy it, how would you do it and where would you hide the remains? After all, if someone did find some of the remains, that would show that the film can had been taken and destroyed by someone. That seems far riskier to me than just casually mislaying it somewhere.
Just musing :-)
Richard
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Oct 5, 2023 17:05:12 GMT
I would like to communicate to anyone out there holding on to stuff because they've had a bad experience with the BBC, BFI or whoever that the people who will most enjoy the return of missing material, fandom (however "fandom" might be defined :-)) and also thousands of people who will enjoy it without being out-and-out fans are not represented by the likes of the BBC, the BFI, etc. If we were, these institutions would fall over themselves with gratitude when you approached them.
On another thread, I mentioned Paul Vanezis, and he confirmed his willingness to act as a go-between. In my humble opinion, Paul represents the thousands of people who will delight in the return of this stuff. That's why he's here on this forum. Others who work in these organisations may well not, so please do not judge the attitude of fandom, etc., on the basis of their attitude.
I'd like to think that as time has passed, this sort of pissing-off of film collectors offering to give things back was a thing of the past. But just in case it isn't, please approach Paul V instead.
Richard
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Oct 1, 2023 8:05:30 GMT
I expect with the 60th anniversary approaching, these rumours are going to resurface.
Richard
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Aug 8, 2023 10:46:07 GMT
It happened to me too with some of the early cassette tapes I had of missing episode audios. Not only did the chap keep them, I later found out that he sold them! Richard Let's have a thread, Massive Betrayals. I'm sure we'd pretty quickly go off-topic if we did that! I wonder whether Chris Perry really has made another statement or whether the press are just milking the one statement that he did make for everything they can? I wish I could find a way of expressing just how important this is for those of us who love the old series, and I really hope that things are moving in the right direction. Richard
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Aug 8, 2023 8:41:06 GMT
I still remember loaning a friend at school my VHS of the Daemons. He moved house & school and I never saw him or my video ever again. I'm still angry 25 years later as it was a birthday present! It happened to me too with some of the early cassette tapes I had of missing episode audios. Not only did the chap keep them, I later found out that he sold them! Richard
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Aug 7, 2023 10:28:21 GMT
Hi Paul, Thank you for your extensive answer. I'm going to slightly quote you back to front here: Not wishing to be rude, but I don't think many of you have any clue at all the effort it takes to garner trust with someone who has lost all trust and importantly has other and more pressing priorities than loaning out their films. I can quite imagine. Hello all, and thank you Richard for entrusting me with your future missing episode recoveries ! :-) Exactly! You *can* be trusted, and they all know you :-) Richard
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Aug 7, 2023 8:41:07 GMT
Well, if I had a missing episode (I wish!), I would simply approach Paul V and there would be nothing to worry about.
Two more points I would like to make on this:
1) Private film collectors have only done us a favour by saving ME's from destruction if, and only if, they return them to the BBC so that we can all enjoy them. I still can't really understand why they don't.
2) We must presumably separate whoever has WoF3 from the considerations we are giving private film collectors. WoF3 was not, after all, rescued from a skip. I'm going to assume, actually, that whoever has it is not a private film collector, or that private film collectors would not wish to be associated with this person or their activities, as it would give them a bad name.
Richard
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Aug 6, 2023 14:03:08 GMT
- hopefully some might allow BBC to make copies of episodes they hold in the not too distant future but no one has any right to demand they do, and any 'annoyed' fans insulting / belittling such collectors by assuming their mindset are hardly likely to change their minds are they ? Patrick The problem is, the "do nothing" option doesn't seem to be achieving much. All I can think of doing with people who are behaving entirely as they are entitled to do but regardless of the harm it is causing others is to try to appeal to their humanity. Daleks will always be Daleks but human beings, to quote the second doctor, will always be within reach of other human beings. And, from an entirely enlightened self-interest point of view, it is my sincere opinion that the more human you are, and the less Dalek you are, the happier a life you will lead. I think we achieve the greatest happiness when we are able to be totally open and honest about who we are and what we do, especially if these are the things that we have chosen to be and do, and receive, as a consequence, the love and admiration of our peers. You don't get there if you do selfish things that you have to be secretive about. Skeletons in closets aren't good. Richard
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Aug 5, 2023 8:51:25 GMT
I would like to add as a corollary to the above that I think this somewhat psychotic behaviour is quite rare, and I rather suspect that our collectors are motivated by a feeling that they have something valuable and that people are trying to swindle them out of it.
If they think like that, then they won't see the legitimacy of humanitarian arguments such as we regularly pose here, because they will interpret them as a disingenuous attempt to wrest from their hands this valuable thing that they have.
Furthermore if in their hearts, they really want to keep it, then they will readily interpret humanitarian arguments as disingenuous.
All we can really do is wait for them to have a change of heart.
Richard
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Aug 5, 2023 8:16:00 GMT
... Some of these guys wouldnt take a few hundred thousand pounds if you waved a suitcase of money in front of their noses - they would rather have the knowledge THEY have it & YOU dont. ... I mean, I hear you, and I do wonder whether this is really what's going on inside people's heads, thinking that doing something awful can make you special. It all sounds a bit bitter and twisted to me. I suppose this is the sort of sentiment that motivated the guy who shot John Lennon. Not only did he kill a man, he took away from the rest of the world someone who was very special. Who knows what John Lennon would have done had been alive to this day? I guess in killing him the killer felt he was special, because he denied us the pleasure of a wonderful and creative man. All a bit horrible, really, and certainly a sentiment that I would want to distance myself from, rather than imagine we were like-minded. Richard
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