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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 27, 2019 21:42:28 GMT
Unlike digging up atari cartridges in the new Mexico desert, which had news paper reports, eye witness accounts and photos to pinpoint a location, dumping of film wasn't really noteworthy. Deciphering a location is next to impossible and the amount of time, capital and human power would be massive. Also, desert conditions are more likely to preserve than NW climate.
Unless we have hard evidence on what is where, it would be next to impossible.
PM'S desert digging (granted, we don't have many details) sounds like a location where only video materials were dumped and burried. Not feasable.
As to the bandsaw, if we found a cache of slashed mixed up material, it might be reassembled. More feasable than random landfill excivation.
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 23, 2019 20:42:11 GMT
It's something I've wondered about before: What if that person had already succeeded in the past? If I were PM I would establish contact just to see what's there. Yup, it'd definitely be worth pursuing the person if PM knows who it is. If you told me to bet money on whether I think this person has at least 1 other ME or not (excluding WOF 3) then i'd personally wager on them having one. It's not the kind of hobby someone would have socially aware up on one 2011 morning and developed overnight, it's likely done by an extreme fanatic who has been into film collecting for years and years, thus could well have been involved in similar activity before. The thought had occurred to me though: could this stuff be arranged to be sold on the black market? Although I do think their personal collection is the motive, missing material being the crown jewel in anyone's collection. Black Market sales are very possible, but it would likely happen very quietly between personal connections only. Im leaning towards it being for a personal collection of a fanatic with capital, time, & connections. Usually, it would be an older person with that kind of free time and disposable capital, which opens the possibility they have been searching for prints for 30-40 years potentially back in the day when recovery efforts were less through than they are now. Over that period of time, quite a few could have been excised from archives through one means or another. It is quite possible such an individual could have been searching before wipings ended and the plight of ME's was known. Someone connected with a broadcaster, having prints marked for return or destruction could be contacted, offered money, and think why not sell them quietly (remove traceable markings) and list them as destroyed? Not likely, but possible. Detection and identification of such an individual(s) would be difficult, ascertaining what they actually have being even more difficult, but accessing said material for recovery might be a feat just short of a miracle. If someone were to go to such lengths to aquire prints, I cant imagine they would ever part with their one of a kind stash. In reality, even if this scenario was true, we would probably never know. As legitimate forgotten archives become exhausted, our hope dwindles to collectors and hoarders, where even if it is known who possesses what, they might not be available for decades or ever. I firmly believe those on the inner circle of DW ME's have definitely thought of this or similar scenarios & probably keep tabs on it. If you knew of a collector that had or likely had missing items, I would think you would want to keep a watch if they were to pass on being able to contact heirs & kin to secure items before they journey to the skip. I have faith in their efforts.
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 22, 2019 21:15:16 GMT
I don't wait for Region 1. Just acquire a multi region player and purchase Region 2.
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 22, 2019 21:13:28 GMT
Exactly. Thanks for putting it this way, this is basically what I was trying to say. If someone is as determined to get their hands on MEs as to contact Phil Morris over it, then they'd have absolutely no qualms with contacting other film collectors, searching high and low at film fairs and other events, having the will power and connections to contact former workers and persons who may have MEs/know of people in the trade etc etc. I would not at all be surprised if the individual(s) behind WOF 3 has other MEs. And this isn't counting a few other people like Terry Burnett out there who unwittingly have an ME or two in their collections. It's something I've wondered about before: What if that person had already succeeded in the past? If I were PM I would establish contact just to see what's there. Agreed. I cant imagine PM ISN'T pursuing it. If the theory holds, the disappearance of Web 3 might be a blessing in disguise, if it were to lead to a small nest of Purloined Prints...
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 22, 2019 21:08:28 GMT
apologies if my optimism seems so high/ too high. I am merely dicussing if there are there any logical loopholes worth considering. I am enthusiastic for this one. I read the novel and always thought it would be brilliant to get a chance to see the complete audio visuals. I am grateful for what we have tho. I would love DMP to come back and MTTU but anything from season 3 would be a amazing find especially as theres many season 3 stories without any visual representation. I think the Star Was type futurism and the ever changing plot of Masterplan is whats grand plus ^ + appeal amongst other factors and the vintage sci-fi elements If you asked me if I believed that there could be copies out there of the other than the already extant 3 episodes of DMP my answer would be well I really don't know... no one really has enough facts because there is always room for the unknown or unexpected or possibility however remote... the odds seem slim but hey you never know. Incidentally do we know what year the video tape masters for masterplan are recorded as being wiped? IIRC 1967
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 21, 2019 20:26:25 GMT
Power was animated? Hummm, I though Pat was walking a bit funny... I agree that wheel's short animation is odd, but I don't feel it has anything to do with a recovery. PM comments about tracing Snowman and wheel after being split from enemy and web are most likely a coincidence with wheel animation. PM is definitely hiding something with his vague statements.... whether its an ep or two or an empty sock drawer remains to be seen.
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 21, 2019 16:14:52 GMT
“T.I.E.A. does not hold any missing episodes of the long-running Dr Who series… They are not missing but destroyed. The end.” <= Quote of the statement released.
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 21, 2019 2:38:15 GMT
Trying not to read too much into PM statements as they are a rabbit hole, I keep thinking along a few lines.
PM said he would only reveal full serials, thus leaving the speculation door open to him possibly having an orphan episode or two. Also stating "Ties does not hold any missing episodes of dw..." PV said he knows of an episode or two in private collection (s)...speculated to be the final resting place of TP4 and DMP4 loaned to blue peter.... what if PV referee to PM's orphaned episode or two? Highly unlikley, but it crossed my mind.
PM said at one point he was contacted by a collector who wanted to discretely buy any dw me he had found to that point. Could this collector have others? They seem to have capital and connections.
Assuming the collector that pilfered Web 3 is different than the one who contacted pm, could this collector have others? Apparently they are connected enough to swipe Web 3 mid recovery.
I think there are more in private hands than is generally suspected. 8-10 doesn't sound too far fetched.
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 20, 2019 22:28:12 GMT
We wait, hope.... and wait some more. Yes all places that purchased Dw are pretty much checked. If any more are in the wild, they are likely in forgotten storage. Private collections might yield a few. I can imagine dumpster divers have aquire some here and there, even if they don't really care about film. Humans are like packrats, some will take and keep things even if they have no need.
We are nearing the end, scrapping the bottom of the barrel.
I believe there are more, but the ME count will likely come to rest in the 80s when all is done.
Who knows, maybe a forgotten storage locker in Costa Rica will yield a story with everyone saying "how did they get here?"
I am hopeful, but won't hold my breath.
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 18, 2019 7:00:19 GMT
I'm gathering the same, but info is scarce so far. Possibly higher quality recordings for eps prior to Dmp 8. Sound experts can use the new tapes to combine, clarify, and augment the DH eps for the most dynamic range outside grams crystal clear eps.... crossing fingers for release of DMP animation in future.
Looking forward to hearing more about this recovery!
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 10, 2019 21:25:24 GMT
Thank you for the link and clarification!
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 10, 2019 20:24:57 GMT
Damian Shanahan has said on a podcast, some years ago now, that he has been trying to access a secure archive in Australia. At some point, he or someone will be able to assess whether DMP is present there. Interesting. I do not recall having heard that before. DMP aside it would be extremely interesting to know if there was ever any progress on this as lots of old silent era films apparently finished their lives down under. I always live in hope of more lost silent era films coming to light. Does anyone have any further info on what happened with this particular lead, just out of interest rather than any expectation of any specific prints? I would love to hear more about this. I have long suspected that private collections "Secure Archives" might be a gold mine for a few random finds, not just DW, but they are likely to be inaccessible. A collector could have corralled quite treasure trove over the years and the existence of said collection might not be known publicly. Without friends, friends of friends, chance encounter & conversations, rare, unique, one-of-a-kind, and only copy left in existence items might remain unknown until someones basement gets cleaned out after there gone and the library at the landfill claims them...
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 10, 2019 20:17:06 GMT
In reading back posts through the years, it seems some believe there were 2 sets. One sent to Australia, one set retained and the blue peter clips were from the supposed second batch. Don't remember reading any real reasoning behind it besides what John Wall mentions frequently. I think the reasoning was that there was the anticipation of sales for the new Season 3 serials based on the Season 2 countries, pre-empting potential sales by striking an additional set of prints in readiness for distribution that ultimately would go unused. This makes sense. Doubt the time and money would be spent in anticipation, but I follow the reasoning. TY for feedback.
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 10, 2019 20:04:47 GMT
If there was missing material of DW on the web anywhere (dark, web, deep web, black web), it would have been copied and dispersed. We would be informed on this board very shortly. I would be surprised if member of this forum are not trolling the corners of the web for just such things. Just an updated version of the rumors 20+ ears ago that there were secret fan conventions where ME were shown. If true, someone would have captured them by armpit cam and they would have come to light. I think it far more likely (still not likely), the dark web would be the place for a print of an ME to appear in an attempt to sell it. Whilst I agree that the dark web would be a likely place for a hoarder to sell an episode, I think the more likely place overall would still be eBay or a car boot sale since I reckon that the largest proportion of missing episodes in private hands would probably be owned by people who don't have a clue what they have and so sell them on unwittingly. Agreed. Ebay and boot sales for those who are ignorant of the rarity. I assume the Dark Web only for someone who knows full well the plight of missing episodes, copyright issues andd just wants to make $ of their find.
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Post by zaqwilson on Jan 10, 2019 17:17:39 GMT
Bottom line: Nobody knows for sure, but the most likely source was the unpurchased Aussie prints. Due to circumstances, its very odd that 3 of 11 (or 12) survived out of one set, where as power & evil fared much worse with better odds. Unless a duplicate ep (that can be verified as not an 80s dupe) shows up, we really have to assume one one set struck. Since all 3 recovered were in Britain, it is wise to assume the set made it back from down under. If one or more eps is ever found down there it will get more complicated. I would not be supersized if another ep of DMP is uncovered though.
In reading back posts through the years, it seems some believe there were 2 sets. One sent to Australia, one set retained and the blue peter clips were from the supposed second batch. Don't remember reading any real reasoning behind it besides what John Wall mentions frequently.
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