The Abominable Snowmen dvd/blu ray release

[mkeown]

I would have preferred that the animations mirrored the broadcast. For me, the next best thing to the actual episodes are faithful reconstructions.

If we were to apply Gary Russell's comments across the board, one could argue that recent adaptations of dramas set about Britain in the past (e.g. A Christmas Carol or Bridgerton) should not include many/any people of colour in the cast as the population would have been 99% white. However colourblind casting seems to be the thing nowadays.

The criticism of The Abominable Snowmen by GR (although I'm sure with the best of intentions) just opens a can of worms.

[John Wall]

Dec 25, 2022 20:43:53 GMT mkeown said:

I would have preferred that the animations mirrored the broadcast. For me, the next best thing to the actual episodes are faithful reconstructions.

If we were to apply Gary Russell's comments across the board, one could argue that recent adaptations of dramas set about Britain in the past (e.g. A Christmas Carol or Bridgerton) should not include many/any people of colour in the cast as the population would have been 99% white. However colourblind casting seems to be the thing nowadays.

The criticism of The Abominable Snowmen by GR (although I'm sure with the best of intentions) just opens a can of worms.

Agreed. It’s important to remember that the past was how it was, but also that we don’t always get an accurate version. Women are half the population and were actively prohibited from many things in the past. Some of their achievements are being rediscovered and that’s a good thing imho.

I think it’s a b-I-g mistake to rewrite history as it, perhaps, might, or should - to some, have been.

That 99% white was probably 99.5% or even 99.9% and non-whites, for want of a better term, were concentrated in places like London and other ports. I suspect that tall, blond Scandinavians were familiar in east coast ports, and London. The darker Mediterranean/North African types would’ve been known in southern/western ports. I bet the inns and taverns of our port towns and cities were full of people wearing different clothes and speaking different languages!

I don’t agree with “plugging in” people to tick boxes. A few years ago there was a black Ann Boleyn, there are paintings that show what she actually looked like. The essential story of Henry VIII is of a patriarch in a deeply patriarchal society who was a desperate for a son. I think they could have explored that in an alternative setting.

[lousingh]

Bias alerts:
1. I think people should not update old productions to make them conform to modern sensibilities. I think we should see the biases of the time, warts and all.

2. I have seen productions of plays, musicals, and operas with Japanese, sub-Saharan Africans, Mexican, and Syrian actors and actresses playing Caucasian parts. I got used to it because the acting was superb. And I still laugh at Dave Allen's last scene from Hamlet sketch.

IMHO, the reproductions should be as faithful to the original as possible. I personally would put a disclaimer about actual Buddhist monks shaving their heads.

Because the video shows bald monks with more prototypically (stereotypically?) Asian, the animators needed to do a better job making sure that we could distinguish between the characters visually. I also would have striven to make the characters look as much like the actors who played the parts as possible.

[Ronnie McDevitt]

Well recently we have had a Glaswegian playing a leading role as a Londoner in Line of Duty and a man - even allowing for him being the writer - playing a womens role in in Mrs Browns Boys. Don't hear too many Cockney actors or females getting on their high horses about being deprived of an opportunity.

[markperry]

I watched the blu ray earlier this month. All 3 recons were pretty good and I'm gonna say the color was pretty good too. The documentary was fine. Although the film sequences reel from Episode 2 wasn't included in full as a special feature as least the raw sound from those film sequences was included within the documentary.
Overall despite thin on the ground as far as more extras it was a pretty good release.

[nathangeorge]

I got this for Christmasand I've juat finished watching. Episode 2 is just wow. Incredible. But after episode 2 I noticed the likenesses.

Gary Russell's argument regarding the likenesses seems a pretty bogus to me. Directors back then used the same actors in many productions, often cast in similar roles. He as good as calls Blake a racist and I don't think that's fair or even accurate. It certainty lacks any honour, senstivity or diplomacy. What is more in evidence is another problem waiting to be vanquished - in all industries but especially in entertainment - and that's nepotism, or the practice of providing 'jobs for the boys'.

I dont have much to do with Who lately, new or old, because everything seems to be very politicised and part of some grubby 'culture war'. It's tiresome and politicising a show about a time travelling alien to the extent we have seen in the last 5 years is exactly as embarassing as it sounds.

The big joke with Snowmen, and why I can't get upset about it, is in his quest for some kind of belated attempt at social justice, Russell has actually reversed engineered the same situation the makers of The Simpsons had when Hank Azaria did the voice of Apu; an Asian character voiced by a white bloke. In my view that's an insulting (and obvious) error, on par with Blake's.

[John Wall]

Jan 3, 2023 17:25:57 GMT nathangeorge said:

I got this for Christmasand I've juat finished watching. Episode 2 is just wow. Incredible. But after episode 2 I noticed the likenesses.

Gary Russell's argument regarding the likenesses seems a pretty bogus to me. Directors back then used the same actors in many productions, often cast in similar roles. He as good as calls Blake a racist and I don't think that's fair or even accurate. It certainty lacks any honour, senstivity or diplomacy. What is more in evidence is another problem waiting to be vanquished - in all industries but especially in entertainment - and that's nepotism, or the practice of providing 'jobs for the boys'.

I dont have much to do with Who lately, new or old, because everything seems to be very politicised and part of some grubby 'culture war'. It's tiresome and politicising a show about a time travelling alien to the extent we have seen in the last 5 years is exactly as embarassing as it sounds.

The big joke with Snowmen, and why I can't get upset about it, is in his quest for some kind of belated attempt at social justice, Russell has actually reversed engineered the same situation the makers of The Simpsons had when Hank Azaria did the voice of Apu; an Asian character voiced by a white bloke. In my view that's an insulting (and obvious) error, on par with Blake's.

You’re right, some directors almost had their own “company” - such as Douglas Canfield - but the main requirement was to be able to learn the lines and deliver them in one take.

[brianfretwell]

Dec 26, 2022 21:20:25 GMT Ronnie McDevitt said:

Well recently we have had a Glaswegian playing a leading role as a Londoner in Line of Duty and a man - even allowing for him being the writer - playing a womens role in in Mrs Browns Boys. Don't hear too many Cockney actors or females getting on their high horses about being deprived of an opportunity.

Well many years ago (1930'-40's) we had Old Mother Riley played by a man (Arthur Lucan) and his "daughter" was played by Kitty McShane (who was actually his wife) - nothing changes.

[John Green]

Jan 7, 2023 10:06:25 GMT brianfretwell said:

Dec 26, 2022 21:20:25 GMT Ronnie McDevitt said:

Well recently we have had a Glaswegian playing a leading role as a Londoner in Line of Duty and a man - even allowing for him being the writer - playing a womens role in in Mrs Browns Boys. Don't hear too many Cockney actors or females getting on their high horses about being deprived of an opportunity.

Well many years ago (1930'-40's) we had Old Mother Riley played by a man (Arthur Lucan) and his "daughter" was played by Kitty McShane (who was actually his wife) - nothing changes.

And speaking of high horses, have you seen pantos lately? Harry the Horse played by two people who only identify as equine (though they were assigned male at an early age).

[ethanmuse93]

Has anyone heard when this will be available for digital streaming and download in the US? Amazon appears to have some of it (not all) but Vudu and iTunes don’t and I can’t find any information when I search.

[ethanmuse93]

Still no iTunes or Vudu digital release in North America. This is ridiculous.