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Post by shellyharman67 on Jan 7, 2014 16:00:27 GMT
Each to their own Absolutely! Without wishing to amble too far off-topic, I prefer to watch programmes as they were originally produced. So for 60s Who material I prefer to watch it in monochrome, with aspect ratio set to 4:3 and any motion 'enhancement' on my TV permanently disabled. I think Vidfire's great and brings the 60s shows to life when compared to film versions, though I understand why some prefer the film look. I also understand why some people feel the same about colourising monochrome as I do about Vidfiring, but it's just not for me. Maybe if I saw some SD-resolution monochrome video colourised so successfully that I didn't know it'd been colourised I might change my mind!! I still don't get the 'prude' bit though! Try experimenting Try it, we all get in our old set ways
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Post by Paul G on Jan 7, 2014 16:07:52 GMT
Absolutely! Without wishing to amble too far off-topic, I prefer to watch programmes as they were originally produced. So for 60s Who material I prefer to watch it in monochrome, with aspect ratio set to 4:3 and any motion 'enhancement' on my TV permanently disabled. I think Vidfire's great and brings the 60s shows to life when compared to film versions, though I understand why some prefer the film look. I also understand why some people feel the same about colourising monochrome as I do about Vidfiring, but it's just not for me. Maybe if I saw some SD-resolution monochrome video colourised so successfully that I didn't know it'd been colourised I might change my mind!! I still don't get the 'prude' bit though! Try experimenting Try it, we all get in our old set ways I have - I just haven't found any colourisation of monochrome at SD resolution that has changed my mind!! (I'm assuming you're not referring to the 'prude' bit, in which case it's probably a discussion for a completely different forum! )
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Post by shellyharman67 on Jan 7, 2014 17:30:14 GMT
LOl. I guess we will have to let the guys on you-tube give us snippets until then
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Post by Justin Watson on Jan 7, 2014 19:18:01 GMT
Try experimenting Try it, we all get in our old set ways I have - I just haven't found any colourisation of monochrome at SD resolution that has changed my mind!! (I'm assuming you're not referring to the 'prude' bit, in which case it's probably a discussion for a completely different forum! ) Have you seen all the clips in that playlist I linked to? ( Here it is again if you missed it) I can understand, some/most of it not being to you liking as there are a great many differing styles, but I thought that there'd be something in there somewhere anyone would find convincing enough (Babelcolour's work for example)? If not then maybe seeing 60's Who in colour just ruins the atmosphere for you (whether it looks true colour or not)...which is fair enough. What did you think of the Pertwee colourisations (Mind of Evil, Planet of the Daleks, Invasion of the Dinosaurs - pt1) or the Tom Baker - Terror of the Zygons extended scene?
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Post by shellyharman67 on Jan 7, 2014 19:42:38 GMT
I dont think the no's will like it no matter. No matter, There are a lot that do Materplan was very good !
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Post by Justin Watson on Jan 7, 2014 20:16:18 GMT
I dont think the no's will like it no matter. No matter, There are a lot that do Materplan was very good ! I agree...the true test for me though will be convincing some of the no's But I do like a challenge.
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Post by Paul G on Jan 8, 2014 8:45:58 GMT
I have - I just haven't found any colourisation of monochrome at SD resolution that has changed my mind!! (I'm assuming you're not referring to the 'prude' bit, in which case it's probably a discussion for a completely different forum! ) Have you seen all the clips in that playlist I linked to? ( Here it is again if you missed it) I can understand, some/most of it not being to you liking as there are a great many differing styles, but I thought that there'd be something in there somewhere anyone would find convincing enough (Babelcolour's work for example)? If not then maybe seeing 60's Who in colour just ruins the atmosphere for you (whether it looks true colour or not)...which is fair enough. What did you think of the Pertwee colourisations (Mind of Evil, Planet of the Daleks, Invasion of the Dinosaurs - pt1) or the Tom Baker - Terror of the Zygons extended scene? Mind of Evil episode 1 was stunning, and I'll admit looked better than most of the rest of the episodes. I've still to watch Planet of the Daleks and Invasion of the Dinosaurs (I'm not really a fan of the Pertwee era). I managed to watch Zygons without the extra scene, so I need to revist that. I'll try to look through them in the next few days as I'm always open to being persuaded! As you say there are a great many different styles and techniques, so I'll watch them with an open mind and a cup of tea!
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Post by mattplace on Jan 8, 2014 9:43:44 GMT
Im a "no" but i do admire some of the work that has gone into this. I think that it would be interesting as a bonus,but i would still prefer to see them in B&W.
The Small clip from Snowmen is the highlight for me, and the DMP bits were solid too. So to the converters, i will admit to wavering slightly from no,maybe a complete episode will push me all the way.
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Post by dougp on Jan 8, 2014 10:23:11 GMT
Matt am with you. The technical work on this is astonishing but am a "no" myself as these were made in b&w and are as such part of Who history and tv history in that format.
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Post by Justin Watson on Jan 8, 2014 10:32:21 GMT
Good to hear from sceptics as open minded as yourselves. I look forward to reading your reactions to the current/future colourisations. The real test of a good colourisation will then be to convince the most ardent of purists (not that you fine chaps are - you seem open to new ideas). *Obviously not all colourisers are the same - some may not be bothered about the challenge of converting scepticism - just pleased when anyone appreciates their efforts .
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Post by Richard Tipple on Jan 8, 2014 10:55:12 GMT
Im a "no" but i do admire some of the work that has gone into this. I think that it would be interesting as a bonus,but i would still prefer to see them in B&W. The Small clip from Snowmen is the highlight for me, and the DMP bits were solid too. So to the converters, i will admit to wavering slightly from no,maybe a complete episode will push me all the way. Glad you enjoyed my DMP footage. Colourisation is a really interesting art. You can ask two different people to produce the same work and they look different - and that for me is part of the appeal. It's a laborious process and blends both the technical with the artistic. I think Babel's work is astonishingly good and something I aspire too, but I also like to think someone could look at my work and identify it as mine. I try and evoke a slight 60's technicolor type style, far less realistic than Babel but I like the magic it adds. I'm learning new skills and techniques all the time, I look back at 'The first Goodbye in Colour' and think "Yuck! I can do much better now!" But with 120,000 odd views and so many kind comments if it had-not been for those kind words I would never have carried on! I'm really enjoying this debate by the way, I don't think it should be too polarising. I think most people are agreed that, as a test, from a fan, colourising an episode of Who would be an interesting test. It's only when you talk about BBC releases of colourised footage that you get strong feelings either way. It's coming along well by the way
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Post by mattplace on Jan 8, 2014 11:53:26 GMT
Im a "no" but i do admire some of the work that has gone into this. I think that it would be interesting as a bonus,but i would still prefer to see them in B&W. The Small clip from Snowmen is the highlight for me, and the DMP bits were solid too. So to the converters, i will admit to wavering slightly from no,maybe a complete episode will push me all the way. Glad you enjoyed my DMP footage. Colourisation is a really interesting art. You can ask two different people to produce the same work and they look different - and that for me is part of the appeal. It's a laborious process and blends both the technical with the artistic. I think Babel's work is astonishingly good and something I aspire too, but I also like to think someone could look at my work and identify it as mine. I try and evoke a slight 60's technicolor type style, far less realistic than Babel but I like the magic it adds. I'm learning new skills and techniques all the time, I look back at 'The first Goodbye in Colour' and think "Yuck! I can do much better now!" But with 120,000 odd views and so many kind comments if it had-not been for those kind words I would never have carried on! I'm really enjoying this debate by the way, I don't think it should be too polarising. I think most people are agreed that, as a test, from a fan, colourising an episode of Who would be an interesting test. It's only when you talk about BBC releases of colourised footage that you get strong feelings either way. It's coming along well by the way I'm no expert, not even an amateur, but to me it seems to be skintone to get right is the hard part, the Snowmen footage has it perfect, some are to"shiny".. Your daleks are the bomb tho... keep up the fantastic work
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Post by shellyharman67 on Jan 8, 2014 12:20:57 GMT
Im a "no" but i do admire some of the work that has gone into this. I think that it would be interesting as a bonus,but i would still prefer to see them in B&W. The Small clip from Snowmen is the highlight for me, and the DMP bits were solid too. So to the converters, i will admit to wavering slightly from no,maybe a complete episode will push me all the way. Glad you enjoyed my DMP footage. Colourisation is a really interesting art. You can ask two different people to produce the same work and they look different - and that for me is part of the appeal. It's a laborious process and blends both the technical with the artistic. I think Babel's work is astonishingly good and something I aspire too, but I also like to think someone could look at my work and identify it as mine. I try and evoke a slight 60's technicolor type style, far less realistic than Babel but I like the magic it adds. I'm learning new skills and techniques all the time, I look back at 'The first Goodbye in Colour' and think "Yuck! I can do much better now!" But with 120,000 odd views and so many kind comments if it had-not been for those kind words I would never have carried on! I'm really enjoying this debate by the way, I don't think it should be too polarising. I think most people are agreed that, as a test, from a fan, colourising an episode of Who would be an interesting test. It's only when you talk about BBC releases of colourised footage that you get strong feelings either way. It's coming along well by the way Thanks Richard ! Top banana stuff mate
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Post by Paul G on Jan 8, 2014 16:25:10 GMT
I've had a chance to look at a couple of the Babelcolour videos, and have a few thoughts/observations:
Whilst the video's presented in SD the actual picture appears within a border. That for me makes it more difficult to evaluate how it would appear on a TV at full resolution.
The colourisation of skin, hair etc... isn't realistic enough for me as it generally looks like a colourwash (albeit with more nuances than I've seen in most colourisation). The clothing is hit and miss; some looks really good, some is less convincing.
The Daleks look really impressive. I'm assuming their being metallic makes them less difficult to colour, as do the quality colour reference photos that are available. The colourisation of lighting effects looks good (for example the Kembel scenes), but I suspect this is because an artificial colour is being cast across the picture so reducing the need for flesh tones etc...
Overall, much of colour has a 'colour wash' appearance, and I'm reminded of the early attempts to recolour Pertwee stories using NTSC colour sources. Maybe I'm expecting too much, but if the argument is that a colourised 60s serial would appeal to a modern-day audience then wouldn't their expectations be the same?
So it's still a 'no' I'm afraid. To be fair I think there are some cases where the resolution of the source video doesn't help, and there are some sections that look fantastic, but overall I'm not as yet convinced. Sorry!
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Post by shellyharman67 on Jan 8, 2014 16:48:05 GMT
I've had a chance to look at a couple of the Babelcolour videos, and have a few thoughts/observations: Whilst the video's presented in SD the actual picture appears within a border. That for me makes it more difficult to evaluate how it would appear on a TV at full resolution. The colourisation of skin, hair etc... isn't realistic enough for me as it generally looks like a colourwash (albeit with more nuances than I've seen in most colourisation). The clothing is hit and miss; some looks really good, some is less convincing. The Daleks look really impressive. I'm assuming their being metallic makes them less difficult to colour, as do the quality colour reference photos that are available. The colourisation of lighting effects looks good (for example the Kembel scenes), but I suspect this is because an artificial colour is being cast across the picture so reducing the need for flesh tones etc... Overall, much of colour has a 'colour wash' appearance, and I'm reminded of the early attempts to recolour Pertwee stories using NTSC colour sources. Maybe I'm expecting too much, but if the argument is that a colourised 60s serial would appeal to a modern-day audience then wouldn't their expectations be the same? So it's still a 'no' I'm afraid. To be fair I think there are some cases where the resolution of the source video doesn't help, and there are some sections that look fantastic, but overall I'm not as yet convinced. Sorry! Its not going to be perfect is it. Is it that people are expecting just too much. This is not done by an expert. Although it is very good in my opinion and i would buy it anyday
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