RWels
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Post by RWels on Feb 27, 2021 11:49:17 GMT
OK but mainstream programs are also welcome if they should turn up there. Missing BBC Sherlock Holmes or comedy. Of course, but as far as I know NRK only showed Norwegian TV programs until the end of 1980s when they started to get British shows like Family Ashton etc. So don't think any missing British media will come from NRK, missing Norwegian media however can be another story...You know best, but it's really surprising. Broadly speaking, I thought UK programs did very well in the North of Europe. Browsing in old newspapers I see drama and comedy in Flemish Belgium, the Netherlands, Germany, Sweden. Even Romania had a period in the sixties when they were very open to British programs. SF is a different story, so I don't expect DW there or Out Of the Unknown. But mainstream sitcoms, sketches, (costuma) drama... Are you sure that some things weren't simply shown that no-one remembers specifically?
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Post by Krisander T. Weum on Feb 27, 2021 17:14:04 GMT
Of course, but as far as I know NRK only showed Norwegian TV programs until the end of 1980s when they started to get British shows like Family Ashton etc. So don't think any missing British media will come from NRK, missing Norwegian media however can be another story... You know best, but it's really surprising. Broadly speaking, I thought UK programs did very well in the North of Europe. Browsing in old newspapers I see drama and comedy in Flemish Belgium, the Netherlands, Germany, Sweden. Even Romania had a period in the sixties when they were very open to British programs.
SF is a different story, so I don't expect DW there or Out Of the Unknown. But mainstream sitcoms, sketches, (costuma) drama... Are you sure that some things weren't simply shown that no-one remembers specifically? Well I was born in 1998 so what 100% happened back then I'm not sure of, but I know that back in those times that NRK was the only TV Channel in Norway until the 80s when we got TV Norge and then in 1990s TV2.
Back atleast in 60s and 70s as far as I know (heard from my parents, read online and gotten to know by people from NRK) They only used to show mostly Norwegian and other Scandinavian tv shows as back then people weren't as well educated in the English language and people were mostly interested (according to NRK) in Drama and Soap opera.
I do know that NRK did may show some drama/western shows from outside of Scandinavia in the 70s like Bonanza and Alias Smith & Jones.
However Sci-Fi and Fantasy ¨wasn't popular enough¨ in Norway according to NRK so they as far as I know didn't show or buy any TV shows in those genres nether from Scandinavia our the rest of the world.
Even though when Star Wars came to Norwegian cinemas (especially The Empire Strikes Back in 1980 since part of it was filmed in Norway) they were very popular among many Norwegian viewers even though the big and main TV Channel of the country meant that ¨the Norwegian people didn't care for those kind of TV/Movie genres as they were for children).
So yeah, for all I know they can have shown outer non-scandinavian shows back in those days that I haven't been told of or found any data of on the internet, but as far for Doctor Who its an extremely low possibility.
But as you said British television of Sitcoms, sketches, soap opera, drama etc. got very popular in Norway in the 90s because thats when Norwegian subtitles got a lot better quality and more TV channels were on the TV instead of just NRK so with shows like Mr. Bean, Eastenders, The Blackadder, Family Ashton, Keeping Up Appearances and many other British shows got more views than the Scandinavian shows back then.
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RWels
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Post by RWels on Feb 27, 2021 20:06:49 GMT
You know best, but it's really surprising. Broadly speaking, I thought UK programs did very well in the North of Europe. Browsing in old newspapers I see drama and comedy in Flemish Belgium, the Netherlands, Germany, Sweden. Even Romania had a period in the sixties when they were very open to British programs.
SF is a different story, so I don't expect DW there or Out Of the Unknown. But mainstream sitcoms, sketches, (costuma) drama... Are you sure that some things weren't simply shown that no-one remembers specifically? Well I was born in 1998 so what 100% happened back then I'm not sure of, but I know that back in those times that NRK was the only TV Channel in Norway until the 80s when we got TV Norge and then in 1990s TV2.
Back atleast in 60s and 70s as far as I know (heard from my parents, read online and gotten to know by people from NRK) They only used to show mostly Norwegian and other Scandinavian tv shows as back then people weren't as well educated in the English language and people were mostly interested (according to NRK) in Drama and Soap opera.
I do know that NRK did may show some drama/western shows from outside of Scandinavia in the 70s like Bonanza and Alias Smith & Jones.
However Sci-Fi and Fantasy ¨wasn't popular enough¨ in Norway according to NRK so they as far as I know didn't show or buy any TV shows in those genres nether from Scandinavia our the rest of the world.
Even though when Star Wars came to Norwegian cinemas (especially The Empire Strikes Back in 1980 since part of it was filmed in Norway) they were very popular among many Norwegian viewers even though the big and main TV Channel of the country meant that ¨the Norwegian people didn't care for those kind of TV/Movie genres as they were for children).
So yeah, for all I know they can have shown outer non-scandinavian shows back in those days that I haven't been told of or found any data of on the internet, but as far for Doctor Who its an extremely low possibility.
But as you said British television of Sitcoms, sketches, soap opera, drama etc. got very popular in Norway in the 90s because thats when Norwegian subtitles got a lot better quality and more TV channels were on the TV instead of just NRK so with shows like Mr. Bean, Eastenders, The Blackadder, Family Ashton, Keeping Up Appearances and many other British shows got more views than the Scandinavian shows back then.
You can safely forget DW. So many people have been over that, it would have already been known about it had happened. And SF simply is more of a niche outside the English speaking world. I'd say it's been on the rise this century but starting mostly in the cinema. I'm going to assume that if you looked in '60s and '70s TV guides or newspaper's TV schedules, that you would find more than you know. Probably more than the romanic speaking countries where the sense of humour isn't understood. I can't think of a reason why Norway would be particularly isolated before the 1990s, when they even got these programs across the Iron Curtain.
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Post by Krisander T. Weum on Feb 27, 2021 20:52:47 GMT
Well I was born in 1998 so what 100% happened back then I'm not sure of, but I know that back in those times that NRK was the only TV Channel in Norway until the 80s when we got TV Norge and then in 1990s TV2.
Back atleast in 60s and 70s as far as I know (heard from my parents, read online and gotten to know by people from NRK) They only used to show mostly Norwegian and other Scandinavian tv shows as back then people weren't as well educated in the English language and people were mostly interested (according to NRK) in Drama and Soap opera.
I do know that NRK did may show some drama/western shows from outside of Scandinavia in the 70s like Bonanza and Alias Smith & Jones.
However Sci-Fi and Fantasy ¨wasn't popular enough¨ in Norway according to NRK so they as far as I know didn't show or buy any TV shows in those genres nether from Scandinavia our the rest of the world.
Even though when Star Wars came to Norwegian cinemas (especially The Empire Strikes Back in 1980 since part of it was filmed in Norway) they were very popular among many Norwegian viewers even though the big and main TV Channel of the country meant that ¨the Norwegian people didn't care for those kind of TV/Movie genres as they were for children).
So yeah, for all I know they can have shown outer non-scandinavian shows back in those days that I haven't been told of or found any data of on the internet, but as far for Doctor Who its an extremely low possibility.
But as you said British television of Sitcoms, sketches, soap opera, drama etc. got very popular in Norway in the 90s because thats when Norwegian subtitles got a lot better quality and more TV channels were on the TV instead of just NRK so with shows like Mr. Bean, Eastenders, The Blackadder, Family Ashton, Keeping Up Appearances and many other British shows got more views than the Scandinavian shows back then.
I'm going to assume that if you looked in '60s and '70s TV guides or newspaper's TV schedules, that you would find more than you know. Probably more than the romanic speaking countries where the sense of humour isn't understood. Its possible to check TV-Guide data on NRKs own website all the way back to those times, but as you go further back (pre 2010s) the TV Guides seems to just get more and more incomplete. Probably some Norwegian folks out there that might have some old newspaper from those eras with complete TV Guides, but on the internet then the NRKs incomplete TV Guides from those eras is the best that I can atleast find.
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Post by Krisander T. Weum on Feb 27, 2021 21:13:03 GMT
Damn, as I googled a little on Norwegian Newspapers there seems to be a website called ¨National Library of Norway¨ where they have apparently tons of books, maps, manuscripts, letters and Newspapers. On the website it says they have digitally copied almost all Norwegian Local and National Newspapers from Present and all the way back to 1763. Didn't know that existed and it seems most of the newspapers that isn't copyrighted can be read for free. Thats awesome, i may have to do some research on some of those newspapers if I can find any in the 60s-80s eras and maybe find complete tv guides. If I do find something interesting, then I'll make a new post in the correct area to not spam this old post.
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Post by Richard Marple on Feb 27, 2021 22:02:49 GMT
It's interesting that NRK stuck to just shows imported from the other Scandinavian countries as well as their own productions.
In the past many countries tended to show quite a few American programmes either dubbed or subtitled if English wasn't well known locally.
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Post by T. Kielland on Feb 28, 2021 23:05:58 GMT
I think the people who remember the time of the television monopoly tend to remember NRK as worse than it actually was. The monopoly lasted in practice until the mid-Eighties perhaps when homes began to get cable, and in 1987/88 the first two Norwegian-language competitors arrived (although some people had received Swedish television since the Sixties). I can remember people complaining in the early 80s that it was only Norway and Albania left in Europe with only one television station.
The point about NRK not buying a lot of non-Scandinavian science fiction is valid (although I can name exceptions to that rule), but the claim that NRK only showed Norwegian/Scandinavian television until the late Eighties is incorrect (even if we allow for Westerns). The majority of programmes were Norwegian, which is only natural, but in the decade I remember best, the Eighties, they showed more British and American television (and movies) than I could possibly hope to remember if I were to try to list it all. But, since the Sixties and Seventies are perhaps more interesting, let's look at November 1970, where I had some newspaper scans lying around for a different project. Here is the non-Scandinavian content that I was able to spot. I have excluded likely dubbed programmes for small children.
Monday 2. November 1970 21.10 Muren. Fransk spillefilm fra 1967. ... (T). ("Le Mur", French movie from 1967, with subtitles)
Tuesday 3. November 1970 21.50 Ad lib - om musikk. Peter Ustinov improviserer og parodierer. (T). (Music programme with Peter Utsinov, with subtitles)
Wednesday 4. November 1970 18.25 I reprise: Vår sivilisasjon. 2. ... (T). ("Civilisation: A Personal View by Kenneth Clark", BBC-made documentary, rerun with subtitles) 21.05 Carol Burnett Show. (T). (with subtitles)
Thursday 5. November 1970 10.10 "Slim John". Leksjon 6. ... Elementærkurs i engelsk. (This was a BBC-made English course made as a science fiction drama)
Friday 6. November 1970 18.20 "Slim John". Leksjon 7. ... Elementærkurs i engelsk. (See above) 21.40 Detek-timen. Paul Temple. Britisk filmserie (T). (British-German crime drama, with subtitles)
Saturday 7. November 1970 18.35 Den merkelige mannen. ... (T). ... ("Catweazle", ITV-made childrens fantasy series, with subtitles) 22.00 Krutrøyk. (T). ("Gunsmoke", US Western series, with subtitles)
Sunday 8. November 1970 18.25 Her kommer LUCY. (T). ("Here's Lucy", US sitcom with Lucille Ball, with subtitles) 21.50 Vår sivilisasjon. 3. ... (T). (See above)
Monday 9. November 1970 21.10 Gudinnen. Amerikansk spillefilm fra 1958. ... (T). ("The Goddess", US movie from 1958 with Kim Stanley and Lloyd Bridges, with subtitles)
Tuesday 10. November 1970 19.00 Vår sivilisasjon. 3. ... (T). (Rerun from Sunday)
Wednesday 11. Novembet 1970 (Nothing)
Thursday 12. November 1970 10.10 "Slim John". Leksjon 7. (Rerun, see above) 21.40 I objektivet. ... (TV). (A Hungarian movie from 1967 for the "especially interested", with subtitles)
Friday 13. November 1970 18.20 "Slim John". Leksjon 8. (See above) 19.10 Ungdomskonsert med Leonard Bernstein. (T). (Youth concert with Leonard Bernstein, with subtitles) 21.10 Detek-timen: Ironside i aksjon. (T). ("Ironside", US crime drama, with subtitles)
I can post the images, but I thought it might spam the post. Also, a while back I looked through a couple of months worth of listings from 1968, and the situation was not that different.
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Post by T. Kielland on Feb 28, 2021 23:33:52 GMT
OK but mainstream programs are also welcome if they should turn up there. Missing BBC Sherlock Holmes or comedy... I noticed that Sherlock Holmes was shown in March of 1968. Given that it lasted 50 minutes I think it's safe to assume that this is the television series with Peter Cushing. Attachment DeletedAs we concluded earlier the reason that finds are unlikely to come from Norway is not that they did not buy programmes, but because they most likely returned (or destroyed) it all afterwards.
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RWels
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Posts: 2,862
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Post by RWels on Mar 1, 2021 7:54:42 GMT
OK but mainstream programs are also welcome if they should turn up there. Missing BBC Sherlock Holmes or comedy... I noticed that Sherlock Holmes was shown in March of 1968. Given that it lasted 50 minutes I think it's safe to assume that this is the television series with Peter Cushing. View AttachmentAs we concluded earlier the reason that finds are unlikely to come from Norway is not that they did not buy programmes, but because they most likely returned (or destroyed) it all afterwards. Yes that is one that I more or less expected, because it was in many other countries. Usually all gone.
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Post by T. Kielland on Mar 1, 2021 8:23:49 GMT
I see that the Peter Cushing episodes began airing on BBC in the fall of 1968, so I suppose this was most likely a Douglas Wilmer episode.
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Post by Krisander T. Weum on Mar 1, 2021 11:30:39 GMT
I see that the Peter Cushing episodes began airing on BBC in the fall of 1968, so I suppose this was most likely a Douglas Wilmer episode. Back in 2015 when I was in Media & Communication (VGS), i was then visiting NRK in Oslo with the class and of course we weren't in the archive itself. However in the costume department and the other departments they had a lot of collectibles from older NRK shows and even from older non-scandinavian shows (that I don't really remember the name of). Even though it may be a stretch, in the fact that they have a lot of Norwegian films and tv shows that haven't been seen since the 80s (Sesame Stasjon) for example, (Uhu!) from the early 2000s and even an old Norwegian Childrens show called ¨Pompel & Pilt¨ that was from the 1960s. They haven't had too many Home Media releases, but they had a lot of collectibles and costumes from those old shows when I was visiting back then. When it comes to the archive itself its of course much more less known, but since they're collecting so much stuff from their older shows. Maybe they have kept more stuff (maybe in the archive) from the older TV Shows? Since NRK started their schedueled TV Airings in the early 1960s. To know what NRK has in their archives without going in and checking yourself is a mystery and those who work in NRK doesn't really care what they have or not in that old archive, but I know those at the Top of NRK has a lot of pride in NRK and their history. Most likely the old BBC shows might as well have been sent back and thrown into the fire, but what I say it may be a chance they didn't send the bought shows back? Of course that may be a huge stretch
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Post by T. Kielland on Mar 1, 2021 16:46:58 GMT
I imagine that it's not uncommon in large archives that gems can be found outside what is listed in the inventory, but NRK is now probably finished digitising their television archives (they were almost finished in 2019), so if it hasn't turned up now it probably isn't there.
It looks to me like they have been very good at retaining their own television history. They haven't kept everything, which would not have been financially possible, but they have kept a lot, including drama productions on the original videotape all the back to 1960. If you search their "Nett-TV" you will find a lot. I have seen the number 30,000 given for available programmes from before 1997, but that number may be obsolete now. I recently watched the beginning of an entertainment cavalcade from 1978 that started with the presenter standing in the NRK videotape archive, where he says that it at the time held roughly 40,000 videotapes, and that is not counting the film archive. I think what NRK has probably kept is foreign children's television that was dubbed into Norwegian, but these will obviously not be released online. I base this on the fact that as late as a Christmas in the late 2000s they repeated the 1977-1982 Moomin series in 4:3 with the "original" Norwegian dub. I hope they have digitised this and keep it even if they can not publish it.
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Post by T. Kielland on Mar 1, 2021 21:39:38 GMT
I realise that we have turned this thread into the Norwegian television thread now, but if the German trail had run dry I suppose we can get away with it.
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Post by John Wall on Mar 1, 2021 22:26:08 GMT
I realise that we have turned this thread into the Norwegian television thread now, but if the German trail had run dry I suppose we can get away with it. It’s always interesting to learn about the situation elsewhere.
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RWels
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Post by RWels on Mar 1, 2021 23:08:14 GMT
Would live action children's television get dubbed too? (As in: not animated cartoons.)
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