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Post by Peter Roberts on Dec 26, 2016 14:29:02 GMT
Brief trailer last night showed a NOBA intro I didn't recognize - two packing crates in a studio, one tall labelled Not Only,the other short labelled But Also. Presumably with Cook and Moore inside them. Could this be from a season two episode? Sounds like Not Only... But Also... in Australia. See YouTube.
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RWels
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Post by RWels on Dec 26, 2016 15:38:42 GMT
Brief trailer last night showed a NOBA intro I didn't recognize - two packing crates in a studio, one tall labelled Not Only,the other short labelled But Also. Presumably with Cook and Moore inside them. Could this be from a season two episode? Australian episode 1. Has not been seen officially for a long time, and wasn't part of The Lost Tapes. Has been around for ages in collector's circles though. Both as the original TV episode, and as filmed insert. Not to be confused with the Australian run of Behind the Fridge, which was also recorded.
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Post by williammuirhead on Dec 27, 2016 0:09:46 GMT
The twist being - wait for it! - Cook's in the short crate, and Dud in the tall! I fear I find the first Australian episode pretty heavy going - in my view, there's much better material (particularly 'Funnel Web Spiders') in episode two.
Any other clips used in the trailer that anyone's able to describe?
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George D
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Post by George D on Dec 27, 2016 2:34:58 GMT
If new material was found, why hasn't an announcement been made as to what was found?
I'm thinking it could be previously existing material.
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Post by williammuirhead on Dec 27, 2016 6:31:38 GMT
Well, PR has been sent to newspapers announcing the programme and stating that recently discovered sketches are part of it, so that seems pretty close to an announcement. NOBA is a pretty low-profile show these days, perhaps largely because of how much is missing, so a public announcement of 'part of series one episode four and all of series two episode six'* being returned would be unlikely to mean much to be most people, let alone a list of stand-alone sketch titles.
The Guardian has reported (without stating a source) that recently 9 sketches were discovered in a basement, and as I posted last page, bradfordzone.co.uk stated the New Years Eve programme will 'showcase a number of new clips which have recently come to light from sketches which were thought to have been lost forever, some not seen for over 50 years, plus rare footage of routines performed in Australia when Cook and Moore made two episodes of their show, Not Only… But Also, back in 1971.'
So some existing material, yes, and some newly recovered material. Unless the papers are wrong - which is certainly possible, but if so they've been inaccurate in some weirdly specific ways.
* Randomly selected episodes for rhetorical purposes.
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RWels
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Post by RWels on Dec 27, 2016 9:15:12 GMT
Unless the papers are wrong - which is certainly possible, but if so they've been inaccurate in some weirdly specific ways. Wouldn't be the first time. It just occurred to me that if you reverse the question, then nearly any sketch could be shown as newly recovered. Well, okay, best to avoid the ones on the DVD. But apart from that, who would know? Just a handful of members here and on FB would notice that this is sketch such-and-such, from series this, episode that, which was already found then-and-then there-and-there. Anyway, the 2 Aussie TV episodes together - would that make 9 sketches? They probably would.
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Post by richardfitzgerald on Dec 27, 2016 12:46:54 GMT
The twist being - wait for it! - Cook's in the short crate, and Dud in the tall! I fear I find the first Australian episode pretty heavy going - in my view, there's much better material (particularly 'Funnel Web Spiders') in episode two. Any other clips used in the trailer that anyone's able to describe? Sorry,they were very brief. The only other one I registered was Cook and Moore facing each other in what looks like a tv interview. Moore is on the left,both have longer hair than in their Sixties appearances so I assumed this was an Australian clip.
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RWels
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Post by RWels on Dec 27, 2016 12:57:05 GMT
Possibly that was the interview footage already used in "the lost tapes" ca. 2000 (where the opening caption confused the stage show with the TV shows)? It's said to've been recorded for the Aussie program "Four Corners" originally.
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George D
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Post by George D on Dec 27, 2016 13:20:10 GMT
My thoughts is an announcement of a special with not seen material is not the same as a list of what was found. Unless the material found is small, then the odds of it all beingin the special are small. Also I doubt during the event they will say, x and you were found recently. They will simply focus on being an entertaining show. As much as I hope this is a find, it's disappointing that bbc, bfi, kaleidoscope, or anyone hasn't confirmed anything . And makes me doubt there was any
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Post by williammuirhead on Dec 27, 2016 13:58:20 GMT
My thoughts is an announcement of a special with not seen material is not the same as a list of what was found. Unless the material found is small, then the odds of it all beingin the special are small. Also I doubt during the event they will say, x and you were found recently. They will simply focus on being an entertaining show. As much as I hope this is a find, it's disappointing that bbc, bfi, kaleidoscope, or anyone hasn't confirmed anything . And makes me doubt there was any Sure. I don't think anyone here would question a dose of healthy skepticism. Nor do I believe that during the event there'll be a freeze frame during a sketch in which an episode number and transmission date is shown. As you say, they'll 'focus on being an entertaining show' (on which note, three cheers for two Cook docs on TV within two months!) And it has already been stated in press articles linked to above that, indeed, the format will be clips from sketches interspersed with talking heads ('the odds of it all beingin the special are small'). While not ideal or our preference, that can't be any enormous shock. What matters to me is that footage from this elusive and largely wiped show may have resurfaced. To go back to what I have tried on multiple occasions to articulate above: there has been specific press confirmation on a) the number of sketches recovered and b) the type of room in which they were found. One article has explicitly stated the prog features newly found material 'unseen for over 50 years' - meaning pre-1967 at the very latest - as well as clips from the '71 Australian eps. This is not a matter of vagueness over what 'recently discovered' might mean - the details of chronology (unseen for 50 years), volume (nine sketches), and location ('found in a basement') are there. I genuinely do not understand this level of pessimism at this juncture. We may, of course, end up disappointed, as we have been before. But unless the Guardian is actively making things up - and BradfordZone just randomly concluded that the show would include both newly recovered NOBA material AND clips from the Australian specials - then something's back. The proof will be in the pudding, of course, but so far all previews of that pudding indicate it'll taste gooooood.
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RWels
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Post by RWels on Dec 27, 2016 17:41:20 GMT
The argument for pessimism is that it can only get better. I'm not even joking.
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Post by John Green on Dec 27, 2016 21:34:41 GMT
My thoughts is an announcement of a special with not seen material is not the same as a list of what was found. Unless the material found is small, then the odds of it all beingin the special are small. Also I doubt during the event they will say, x and you were found recently. They will simply focus on being an entertaining show. As much as I hope this is a find, it's disappointing that bbc, bfi, kaleidoscope, or anyone hasn't confirmed anything . And makes me doubt there was any Sure. I don't think anyone here would question a dose of healthy skepticism. Nor do I believe that during the event there'll be a freeze frame during a sketch in which an episode number and transmission date is shown. As you say, they'll 'focus on being an entertaining show' (on which note, three cheers for two Cook docs on TV within two months!) And it has already been stated in press articles linked to above that, indeed, the format will be clips from sketches interspersed with talking heads ('the odds of it all beingin the special are small'). While not ideal or our preference, that can't be any enormous shock. What matters to me is that footage from this elusive and largely wiped show may have resurfaced. To go back to what I have tried on multiple occasions to articulate above: there has been specific press confirmation on a) the number of sketches recovered and b) the type of room in which they were found. One article has explicitly stated the prog features newly found material 'unseen for over 50 years' - meaning pre-1967 at the very latest - as well as clips from the '71 Australian eps. This is not a matter of vagueness over what 'recently discovered' might mean - the details of chronology (unseen for 50 years), volume (nine sketches), and location ('found in a basement') are there. I genuinely do not understand this level of pessimism at this juncture. We may, of course, end up disappointed, as we have been before. But unless the Guardian is actively making things up - and BradfordZone just randomly concluded that the show would include both newly recovered NOBA material AND clips from the Australian specials - then something's back. The proof will be in the pudding, of course, but so far all previews of that pudding indicate it'll taste gooooood. William,well argued,but the standard of journalism these days-especially when it comes to "lost for X years" means that I bring along more pinches of salt than are found in the average ready-meal.Apparently-wasn't it the Mirror both times?-every episode of DW has been found,including Marco Polo "filmed off the television".If these people told me they'd had a secret midnight meeting on Hampstead Heath where they were shown cans of Power,I'd want to see the moon by the light of which the cans were viewed,so I'd have some proof.
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Post by williammuirhead on Dec 29, 2016 4:52:14 GMT
Thanks John, I quite take your point and I hope I haven't been coming across as antagonistic in my previous posts. The Guardian at least is pretty well respected, isn't it? (I remember rolling my eyes at those 'Polo' articles in the Mirror at the time - obvious fantasy!)
Anyway, I have no more info than anyone else here, and am prepared for further disappointment. Just the thought of nine new sketches, however, is a tantalising prospect indeed.
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Post by williammuirhead on Dec 29, 2016 5:24:51 GMT
Hello again, friends! On the subject of the Australian NOBAs, here's the sketch list as printed in the 'Publish and Bedazzled' Cook fanzine in late 2000:
Show 1 (broadcast on ABC 8th February 1971, and on BBC1 June 18th): Pete & Dud: Customs/On the Beach/At the Cricket/Sir Arthur: Teaching Funnel-Web Spiders to Swim/Shirt Shop (originally written for Kenneth Williams in the early sixties)
Show 2 (broadcast on ABC 15th February 1971, and on BBC1 25th June) 'Colonel Bogey'/One Leg Too Few/Bollard (these past three all previously performed in 'Beyond the Fringe')/Job Interview (aka 'Pseudolene', possibly a remake of a sketch from NOBA s01e05)/Pete & Dud: Homeward Bound
Now, the particularly observant Muldoon will notice that this is a very different sequencing for Episode One (and therefore, presumably, for Episode 2) than a Certain Video Site would suggest. The 'Ep 1' presented on said site offers the following sketches:
Show 1: Pete & Dud: Customs/Pete and Dud: Cricket (film sequence and locker room VT)/Dudley Moore Trio/Shirt Shop/Colonel Bogey/One Leg Too Few/Goodbyeee
And an extant Aussie off-air from Show 2, accordingly, has the remaining sketches in this order:
Show 2: Pete & Dud: At the Beach/Sir Arthur - Funnel-Web Spiders/The Dudley Moore Trio/Job Offer (Pseudolene)/Bollard/Pete and Dud: Homeward Bound/Goodbyeee
So that would seem to be, at least, the correct contents for the original Australian transmissions. Irrelevant to the conversation, perhaps - but, in the words of the estimable Mr Cook (from 'Prospective Son in Law', NOBA e01e04), 'Not that it matters, but it is important.'
EDIT: And of course it turns out that just this info is already available on IMDB. Sorry for the redundant posts, chaps!
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Post by richardfitzgerald on Dec 31, 2016 12:49:12 GMT
The Radio Times preview mentions how short some of the clips are? Could these be material found from the Australian censor?
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