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Post by Stuart Huggett on Jan 13, 2010 15:35:56 GMT
6. 31/03/1981 'Weapon of Peace' - Suss & If & 'Hawks' - Words of Hope & Bullfighter Blimey, Hawks - Really early Stephen 'Tin Tin' Duffy!
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Post by Paul Vanezis on Jan 13, 2010 16:35:29 GMT
Blimey, Hawks - Really early Stephen 'Tin Tin' Duffy! Indeed. And very early Paul King - Reluctant Stereotypes!
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Post by johnstewart on Jan 13, 2010 16:58:45 GMT
It was all good though and I should point out that everyone involved in the restoration of the three programmes did it all for no recompense. No recompense apart from the undying gratitude of those who attended. The Look! Hear! stuff was the highlight of the day for me, particularly the Swinging Cats, and it all looked far too good to have come from VHS, so thanks for the explanation. BBC West had equivalent shows, including RPM, and an earlier one the name of which escapes me, but which included very early performances by XTC, among others. I mentioned these to Dick on Saturday, in hopes that a regional music shows event might be a goer. I liked the audience - reminded me of 'SOMETHING ELSE'. Had a problem working out the date whilst watching; 'two tone' was up and coming late '79 seem to recall; but memory of 'Selector' dated them as being '80 - '81 period. Of course the slightly 'flared' look put it closer to '79. My highlights were 'His Lordship Entertains' a real surprise as I'd not heard of its recovery and the '67 TOTP material. My 'low lights' have to say really the '76 TOTP. Though apparently missing I seemed to have seen most of the act clips on other editions; at least the 'best' ones for me (i.e. Sailor - Glass of champagne use to like that one). '76 was for me reach for the radio and obscure John Peel album bands until something exciting happens - period. 'So it Goes' was the point at which I began sitting up again at TV pop.
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Post by johnstewart on Jan 13, 2010 17:14:56 GMT
It was a great event.Particularly wonderful to see the '67 TOTP material, even in it's damaged state it had so much atmosphere..a real thrill. Just wondering about the 'Time For Blackburn' episode: I had some of the Who clip on an edition of Southern Gold, the Fred Dinenage hosted Meridian show that delved into the Southern archives. Can't recall when it was on, some time in the early '90s I think. That would have been from the same copy, would it, and just gone astray at some point? Maybe it did a double somersault and disappeared up itself for a while Just curious. Regarding the TOTP seems the Pink Floyd management may do something - according to Dick Fiddy - with 'See Emily'. I think that may be one where they used the record; so the speed variation on sound could be redubbed. I thought the vision gaps could be plugged with an 'info' section with stills of the band and facts in type face. But at best maybe mix in clips from the other available 'Emily' material. Supposedly the Jonathan Miller 'Alice' play was used as well as the usual Belgium film stock clip seen. I'd like to see the BBC utilise all the band clips we saw. For some reason Tom Jones crashed to a halt, but the Procol Harum could be fade and mixed perfectly well in break ups to other images and voice over in documentary context. Make a change from the usual Xmas clip. I noted too how The Vocalists gear and 'tache; and the Robin Trower replacement guitarist appeared. This matches the oft seen colour promo which I always thought had been mixed with footage from the rerelease in '72 or so. So too that 'Turtles' clip; as I understand 'Happy Together' was represented by something else so the shown hit was their only studio TOTP appearance. 'His Lordship' (o/t now) matched what I recall bar that in this episode Lord Rustless appeared to be running the Country mansion as a Fawlty Towers type Hotel. In the only scene I recall from the time; David Jason as the Gardener is sitting with Lord Rustless at a round metal table on the veranda in the Houses back garden by some French windows. Rustless was seen in the old 'Hark at Barker' gear with the bow tie. I thought the writing of that one was remarkably quick and strong. The BBC seemed to have kept everything of Barker but this. I suggested some time ago though the reason could be as it was on BBC2 which had a policy of having all comedy tapes wiped quickly. It could be argued the following effort 'Open all hours' is an inferior product; but appeared on BBC1 and was seen to be more inherently commercial at the time. The 'Till Death' was very strong too. People should bear in mind at the time the public didn't like the show as it was shocking. They only took to it when Garnett returned in the '70s presumably as it was a familiar face they recalled from years ago. I always find the series hovers between a sitcom and a disturbing drama like something Pinter would have written and would be shown after 9 p.m. Did anyone else wonder if Tony Booths face slapping was an improvised moment?
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Post by davemachin on Jan 14, 2010 14:21:55 GMT
Like you John, I think a lot could be done with the 1967 footage as the undamaged bits were good quality images. Mixing to stills would be an acceptable solution or intercutting other video if it was in style. I am sure that more repair work might bring back more of the original image though. As these clips are all valuable examples, all the stops should be pulled out to restore to the max. The one-off live vocal on Whiter Shade with Gary Brooker improvising to cover the fluffs (was he stoned?) makes this another reason to cherish the material as unique.
There is a Procol Harum colour promo of Whiter Shade where Gary Brooker is sporting the same hat and moustache. I always assumed it was a latterly made film but it is exactly as he appears on Top of the Pops. I forget the guitarist's name here but Trower had yet to join (he is on the xmas show miming the song) and this guy was only in the lineup for a couple of months or so, which makes this clip probably the only existing footage of him with PH.
(Sorry if this is not relating to the music session, mods. I'm just replying to John's point). I agree with you about Open All Hours being inferior compared to some of Barker's other work but when it started I can remember it on BBC2 a bit out of the way and kind of a niche comedy. Only later on did it become more popular and bigger in the public's eyes. I don't know when it switched to BBC1 but this is maybe when it came to be seen as one of his main series. It is a limited one joke type of series and His Lordship shows Barker much more at his best.
Dave
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Post by markjhaley on Jan 14, 2010 23:59:50 GMT
I had an email from a Kinks fan today. He referred to a rather amazing book ( I have a copy of it somewhere) that details just about everything the band did over the entire existence of the band, written by a guy called Doug Hinman in the USA who wrote several books about the Kinks - the last of which was published in 2004. In one of his books Hinman refers to a Dave Davies television appearance where Dave is mistakenly introduced as Ray Davies... Here's the exact quote: "Dave is introduced as Ray Davies by TOTP host Alan Freeman. A short film clip by Ray (content unknown) is shown directly before Dave's appearance." That implies to me that a Kinks fan in the USA was aware of the content of that TOTP appearance at least 6 years ago, almost certainly longer. I suppose it's most likely an audio tape he heard, or just maybe there's more than one video of that Top Of The Pops kicking around. I've asked if it can be investigated further. www.amazon.co.uk/Kinks-Concerts-Recordings-Broadcasts-1964-1997/dp/087930765X
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Post by Thomas Walsh on Jan 15, 2010 5:05:22 GMT
I'm surprised any KINKS fan didn't queue up for the Doug Hinman book Mark..it's FANTASTIC and essential. T.
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Post by Paul Watkins on Jan 15, 2010 13:22:03 GMT
In an interview circa 1981/2 (cant remember exactly, may have been Pebble Mill) Ray Davies stated that he had video tapes/reels of 'most' of the Kinks TV appearances. I think that may be the source of many Kinks clips that have survived.
Perhaps someone should enquire to see if Ray recorded/has the full editions of the programmes that they appeared on?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2010 15:58:26 GMT
In one of his books Hinman refers to a Dave Davies television appearance where Dave is mistakenly introduced as Ray Davies... Here's the exact quote: "Dave is introduced as Ray Davies by TOTP host Alan Freeman. A short film clip by Ray (content unknown) is shown directly before Dave's appearance." That implies to me that a Kinks fan in the USA was aware of the content of that TOTP appearance at least 6 years ago, almost certainly longer. I suppose it's most likely an audio tape he heard, or just maybe there's more than one video of that Top Of The Pops kicking around. I've asked if it can be investigated further. Very interesting! It wouldn't surprise me if there was an extra copy of that TOTP edition existing in the USA as a t/r though as this has been rumoured very strongly for many years now (certainly ONE of the editions featuring See Emily Play has and it could well be this one, for all we know)! Keep us all posted if you manage to follow this up, Mark! By the way, the Doug Hinman book is an essential read for anyone interested in The Kinks. It's basically the groups' equivalent of what Mark Lewisohn did for The Beatles and very thorough. I'm interested also in Paul's comment about Ray claiming to have most of the groups' appearances on video - maybe this can be looked into by someone with links to the man himself?
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Post by davemachin on Jan 15, 2010 17:36:40 GMT
Just want to add my vote for Doug Hinman's book on The Kinks. It's a great read and the sort of thing I like to find in my christmas stocking!
It is interesting about the rumours of more Top of the Pops surviving out there. I used to be in touch with music fans across the pond and an appearance of Pink Floyd performing Emily used to regularly crop up in conversation. Quite a few creditable people will swear that such a clip lives in the states, either as a single item or a whole show. This has been talked about for over twenty years and seems to not want to die down in the way other rumours fade away eventually. I'm not saying I have any evidence to support the existence of the clip but false stories tend to be discredited eventually. This one just seems to carry on.
Dave
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Post by LanceM on Jan 15, 2010 17:59:07 GMT
Have likewise been hearing of this myself for some time.Dave said it there,just seems to go on repeating itself every now and then.In light of the two 67 TOTP editions turning up it would not surprise me if these rumors did not ressurect themself here in respect.Would be interesting indeed if there were such a recording existing in the US in private hands as has been rumored for so very long.Like so many other rumors that persist from time to time I will believe it when I see it.Clearly further investigation might be in order here.
Was the footage of the same nature as far as the Turtles and Procol Harum and of course Mr.Davies performance as far as the overall quality of the returned-restored footage?Fasinating in regards to the Kinks book and previous mention of the TOTP performance,would think contacting the author may be the best course of action to attempt to learn further info there.Being able to contact the Kinks in regards to wether they hold the complete performances for the previously mentioned material.Fingers Crossed as they say!
Cheers,Lance.
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Post by lfbarfe on Jan 15, 2010 18:06:55 GMT
I have a lot of rare XTC regional stuff inc. RPM (XTC - Play At Home) and BBC Bristol appearances including a lovely (though time-coded) copy of XTC At The Manor from 1980. Which BBC Bristol show has Barry Andrews-era XTC doing stuff against a plain white cyclorama? Is that RPM, or some other show? A mutual friend of ours showed it to me years ago.
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Post by ajsmith on Jan 15, 2010 20:06:33 GMT
I've been in contact with Doug Hinman before, here's his e-mail addy if anyone's wants to inquire/congratulate him personally on his book: doughinman@comcast.net
What I want to know is: So the Alan Freeman Ray/Dave mixup intro exists (as noted by those fortunate enough to see the recent screenings) as part of the 1967 Top of the Pops recoveries, but does this Ray Davies short film exist? Or did it fall between the cracks of the damaged archive film? Or is it not present at all, and Hinman's book was mistaken?
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Post by Thomas Walsh on Jan 15, 2010 21:07:20 GMT
I have a lot of rare XTC regional stuff inc. RPM (XTC - Play At Home) and BBC Bristol appearances including a lovely (though time-coded) copy of XTC At The Manor from 1980. Which BBC Bristol show has Barry Andrews-era XTC doing stuff against a plain white cyclorama? Is that RPM, or some other show? A mutual friend of ours showed it to me years ago. Hi LF.....Our mutual friend is a VERY good friend so it's nice to say hello to you here. The show is not refered to in the 20 minute piece XTC did in 1979, but the end credits say the show was 'Directed by Roy Chapman' and they also wanted to make it very clear that it was a 'BBC WEST PRODUCTION'. T.
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Post by johnstewart on Jan 16, 2010 19:27:09 GMT
Like you John, I think a lot could be done with the 1967 footage as the undamaged bits were good quality images. Mixing to stills would be an acceptable solution or intercutting other video if it was in style. I am sure that more repair work might bring back more of the original image though. As these clips are all valuable examples, all the stops should be pulled out to restore to the max. The one-off live vocal on Whiter Shade with Gary Brooker improvising to cover the fluffs (was he stoned?) makes this another reason to cherish the material as unique. There is a Procol Harum colour promo of Whiter Shade where Gary Brooker is sporting the same hat and moustache. I always assumed it was a latterly made film but it is exactly as he appears on Top of the Pops. I forget the guitarist's name here but Trower had yet to join (he is on the xmas show miming the song) and this guy was only in the lineup for a couple of months or so, which makes this clip probably the only existing footage of him with PH. (Sorry if this is not relating to the music session, mods. I'm just replying to John's point). I agree with you about Open All Hours being inferior compared to some of Barker's other work but when it started I can remember it on BBC2 a bit out of the way and kind of a niche comedy. Only later on did it become more popular and bigger in the public's eyes. I don't know when it switched to BBC1 but this is maybe when it came to be seen as one of his main series. It is a limited one joke type of series and His Lordship shows Barker much more at his best. Dave That surprise welcome return is only different in Rustless running a Hotel rather than his Country Mansion. I came to the series just before it ended - short run apparently 7 shows only. I think the wiping was down to the BBC2 policy with comedy. Apparently they wanted comedy tapes cleared off quickly so other genre shows could be recorded.
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