Off-air recordings held at Record Companies?

[martinb]

This may have been covered before...
Many years ago, a kindly contact at EMI supplied me with a copy of their broadcast tape of one edition of the Marc Bolan show (Granada TV 1977). Although I already had its content as all the shows survived, it was the original transmission, complete with the adverts from the break in the middle.
I have never really thought about this since, but this would suggest that there may have been a tradition of record labels recording their artists' appearances on TV.
Does anyone else have experience of this? Is it a dead horse that has already been flogged? If not, an opportunity may exist.

[Deleted]

I've always wondered about this avenue too, Martin. Definitely worth exploring, i'd say, although I don't know how thoroughly others have really looked into it. Sounds perfectly reasonable that companies wanted reference copies of their artists' appearances. Ad agencies seemed to tape commercials too, so it would be interesting to see how far this practice goes back and how easy it would be to access the material...

[Mark Tinkler]

Having produced 50 Years of Island earlier this year, I can tell you that record companies may well have some stuff but alot may be duplicates of what broadcasters have nowadays. I looked at Island's own copies of the "25 Years of" programmes and many of the 1" tapes were un-playable due to mould.
Down to the old question of the cost return for them may not be enough as they may only have a very few things.
Certainly in the current climate and the changeover of staff, Record Companies memories only seem to go back about 5 years...

[davemachin]

Thanks Mark. What I've always wondered is how well archived are the film and video promos made by the record companies to promote records. Back in the seventies these sometimes were shown on Top of the Pops and if they were on video would fit in like they were made for the programme. I can remember ones for Cockney Rebel (Judy Teen), Elton John (Daniel) and ELO (10538 Overture). Earlier, the Stones had colour clips made by the record company (2000 Light Years From Home). My question is are these looked after as well as the master tapes of the music? I'd hope so as they are just another aspect to the artist's work.

On Laurence's point about adverts, I have often noticed that the agencies seem to keep off air recordings of these. Sometimes they are used in documentaries and also filter out on the collecting circuit. Some go right back to the seventies and I have even seen the odd few from earlier. You would think that if the agencies were taping ads, there would be times when some other things like continuity and bits of programmes were caught on a tape. This is an area of missing television that has not been explored enough yet and even if a lot of the things are just duplicating what tv archives have, there may be the odd times when there is a rarity that makes it worthwhile. It's all fascinating to me.

Dave

[Mark Tinkler]

To show you how accurately at least some of the record companies keep records of old pop videos, I was asked by Island if I could supply to them for their exhibition celebrating 50 Years, a copy of the Frankie Goes To Hollywood "Relax" video...
I rest my case.

[davemachin]

I'll take that as bad news about record companies being thorough then, Mark. Even so I'd expect them to have some material tucked away that they are not even particularly aware of. O to be given a free reign to scour the vaults!

Dave

[Gary Critcher]

'To show you how accurately at least some of the record companies keep records of old pop videos, I was asked by Island if I could supply to them for their exhibition celebrating 50 Years, a copy of the Frankie Goes To Hollywood "Relax" video...'
Not in the least bit surprised by that at all.
When I worked at CTV (that's the ORIGINAL Carlton TV) in St.John's Wood, a favourite pass time of mine on a slow Saturday was to go up in the loft and rifle through all the 'P' spools (1" short tapes) that were the MASTER tapes for hundreds of pop videos. The record companies certainly never seemed interested in looking after them , as we had them all. This stuff dated from around 1982 - 1989.
Aside ; it was CTV who did the edit for Bowie/Jagger's 'Dancing In The Street' Live Aid record. It was shot during the day and edited during the same night.

[Richard Moore]

I do know that EMI records now kees all the tapes sent into it's archives - a considerable number come in each day - This includes everything from production tapes to masters including quite a lot of video. As far as i'm aware they have master tapes of ALL videos that they own. What they won't have is material which was licenced to them as this is usually sent back to the coyright owner once the licencing term is over (although the odd thing does slip through the net).

Universal probably are the same, however in my exerience they are lazy and don't want to send time on money transfering from older formats to modern if there is no real money in it for them - hence asking fo somebody else's copy to save them the bother!

[davemachin]

How far do these EMI videos go back. Richard? Are we talking just eighties vintage onward, for instance?

You would think record companies would see videos as an extension of the music they promote and so worth keeping, especially in this dvd age, what with releases and channels like VH1 showing them endlessly.

Didn't the BBC make some sort of deal with EMI about a year ago where they would mutually tap in to each other's archives for releases? Maybe this will promote better archiving and cataloguing by them both? From what people are saying, record companies may keep some visual masters. It's more haphazard and uncatalogued but they don't seem to have had either a deliberate wiping or deliberate keeping policy at any time like the BBC have.

On a side note to this, who owns the rights and physical master to the E.L.O. clip of 10538 Overture that gets seen from time to time (starts with fish-eye lens shot)? Is this released on a dvd? Quite a valuable clip as it's one of only a few with the original line-up. I assume it is a record company promo and not a tv appearance.

Dave

[Richard Moore]

I can't say exactly - I only get access to the material i need for a roject rather than everything, but I would guess that they hold master copies of every video they own the copyright too from whenever they actually started making them.

The BBC deal is actually one sided, EMI can use a vast amount of BBC material but the BBC don't have the rights to EMI material.

Can't answer the ELO question i'm afraid.

[Paul Watkins]

I've always had the impression that the ELO 'video' is a TV produced performance and not a promotional video. From the look of it, i think it's been filmed on 'video' not 'film' (film was common around that time), although it's difficult to see on many prints that are circulating.
Yes this clip apparently originated from EMI's vaults, but did they get it from anywhere else?

Anyone able to see a logo on the camera's that are shown in the clip

[Thomas Walsh]

Hi guys.

The E.L.O clip is widely available as part of the DVD-ROM feature of 'The Electric Light Orchestra' re-issue. It was an E.M.I promotional film.

www.ftmusic.com/shop_elo1ukcd_cc.html

T.

[Mark Tinkler]

If anyone wants to do anything at EMI, I'd do it as soon as soon as possible while it's still there...

[davemachin]

Dec 8, 2009 7:19:23 GMT Thomas Walsh said:

Hi guys.

The E.L.O clip is widely available as part of the DVD-ROM feature of 'The Electric Light Orchestra' re-issue. It was an E.M.I promotional film.

www.ftmusic.com/shop_elo1ukcd_cc.html

T.

Thanks Thomas. I thought it was an EMI promo but wasn't sure. Looks like it was shot by video on to film though as it has like a telerecorded look to it.

Is the dvd-rom clip playable on normal dvd players or just computers?

Dave

[Richard Moore]

Posted by Mark Tinkler on Today at 11:33am
If anyone wants to do anything at EMI, I'd do it as soon as soon as possible while it's still there...

One thing that certainly isn't going anywhere is EMI's archives - Their back catalgue sales are still making a profit!