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Post by dennywilson on Feb 2, 2012 18:41:45 GMT
As I've pointed out in the past, it's been over 20 years since the last DW Lost Episodes were recovered from a former broadcaster - TOMB OF THE CYBERMEN.
Isn't it highly likely that nothing is left to find with the former broadcasters? Yes, I know that in the early 1980's HK said they weren't holding anything - and low and behold, they were holding this and other BBC Material from the 1960's recovered a few years later.
However, thanks to all the research over the years since - It's now known how episodes were bicycled by the BBC and TIE in the 1960's, there's a clear understanding where episodes were and where they went to,and their final stop was. (Yes, we all know the sad possibility of what may or may not have happed in Serra Leone! - thankfully they weren't the last broadcaster to air Season 3 - just the last in Africa) With the rest of Africa checked (or nearly checked) they've exhausted one area which would have been a final stop for episodes. (Nigera aired 4 missing Troughton Stories in 1974/1975 - too bad they didn't find anything.)
If anything is found with in the remaining film stores of the last of the former broadcasters to be checked, I would be surprised. HK, Singapore, Australia and NZ have been checked and re-checked several times over the years - I really doubt anything will be all of a sudden found.
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Post by David Cann on Feb 2, 2012 20:24:05 GMT
As much as I want to think otherwise, I believe that you're right - Africa has been checked, and the other main markets have been contacted to death over the years. The chances of anything remaining in the few other countries not covered by this quota are very slim - all have confirmed that they no longer have films, and pretty much our only chance is that they are sitting forgotten in the back of a vault somehwere, mis-filed. Judging by the fact that this would require a most incredible stroke of luck, I think that we can pretty much definitively say that there's nothing left in the vaults of overseas broadcasters any more - though I'd love to be proved wrong! But now I believe that the greatest chance of recoveries lies with private collectors who either don't know the value of what they're holding (one of the few errors in Wiped! was that it gave the impression that 99% of film collectors are aware of missing episodes of Doctor Who, whereas Mr Burnett's recent revelation seems to tell a different story) or are purposely with-holding material for some reason. Then again, there's always the faint glimmer of hope that perhaps something is lurking out there in a mis-filed film can... but the chances are, it's not.
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Feb 2, 2012 21:55:47 GMT
I think the greatest chance of recovery comes from private collectors / individuals rescuing film cans from foreign TV stations, in much the same way as has happened here, but with a much greater chance that they are not aware of what they have in their cupboard.
This could even have happened in Sierra Leone prior to the war there. In fact, if someone had a mind to do it, they probably could have walked in to the TV station there in years gone by and walked out with the stuff.
I think, therefore, that we shouldn't give up on TV stations abroad, at least indirectly. If I had the resources to do so, I would try to get in touch with ex-employees, in particular ones who were there at the time when the material was there.
Richard
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Post by Jon Preddle on Feb 2, 2012 22:17:50 GMT
This could even have happened in Sierra Leone prior to the war there. In fact, if someone had a mind to do it, they probably could have walked in to the TV station there in years gone by and walked out with the stuff. As much as the idea is attractive, you do have to ponder that if someone in SL did wander off with the films, what would they do with them? In 1966, the population of SL was over 2 million. The number of licensed TV sets was 1000! By 1984, there were 21,500 sets. It's unlikely anyone who did take any films would have the means by which to view them (a 16mm projector and screen was not the sort of thing the average Sierra Leone resident would possess.) In my thinking, if anyone did walk off with reels of film, it would be a Sierra Leone farmer, who wandered past, saw the stack of films, and thought, "oh, look, lots of funny-looking plastic rope - I could use that to tie up the broken cattle fence..." |
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Post by John Green on Feb 2, 2012 22:19:36 GMT
On another site people are reminiscing about the Television Centre.Tales of "tapes stacked in lines down the edges of the corridor because the library wasn't big enough",and former or non employees getting in with any old bit of laminated card.
How secure were these tapes?
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Richard Develyn
Member
Living in hope that more missing episodes will come back to us.
Posts: 574
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Post by Richard Develyn on Feb 2, 2012 23:11:27 GMT
Actually, I just think someone who worked at the TV station, and had seen and enjoyed something on the TV that they now saw lying discarded somewhere, might just pick the thing up and take it home with the thought that maybe one day they'll find some way to watch it again, and then left it languishing in some garden shed all forgotten.
It's the sort of thing I would do. I'm a bit of a magpie at heart :-)
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Post by John F Brayshaw on Feb 2, 2012 23:44:30 GMT
Well we can hope. Has anyone thought that since of the film cans labeled Dr. Who which had the wrong stuff in them ~ did anyone at the BBC double check the cans of the stuff that was actually in the Dr. Who cans? Or did they just assume the stuff in the cans was whatever it was labeled?
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Post by johndz on Feb 3, 2012 0:53:11 GMT
Well we can hope. Has anyone thought that since of the film cans labeled Dr. Who which had the wrong stuff in them ~ did anyone at the BBC double check the cans of the stuff that was actually in the Dr. Who cans? Or did they just assume the stuff in the cans was whatever it was labeled? I'm sure you're on to something here. I can't imagine that anyone would have ever thought of that. |
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Post by Brad Phipps on Feb 3, 2012 0:57:06 GMT
As I've pointed out in the past, it's been over 20 years since the last DW Lost Episodes were recovered from a former broadcaster - TOMB OF THE CYBERMEN. Lost episode was 1991, but the last Dr Who episode recovered from a broadcaster was 1995 (ABC in Australia returned an unedited copy of The Dominators 5). Just sayin'.  |
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Post by John F Brayshaw on Feb 3, 2012 2:41:39 GMT
Well we can hope. Has anyone thought that since of the film cans labeled Dr. Who which had the wrong stuff in them ~ did anyone at the BBC double check the cans of the stuff that was actually in the Dr. Who cans? Or did they just assume the stuff in the cans was whatever it was labeled? I'm sure you're on to something here. I can't imagine that anyone would have ever thought of that. More like the world's biggest D'OH! Moment in history. But I wouldn't be surprised by anything now.... |
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Post by nicholas young on Feb 3, 2012 3:25:01 GMT
Although the odds are heavily against it and it is extremely unlikely, a lost Dr.Who episode maybe lurking around somewhere, forgotten, misfiled, in the wrong film can, perhaps even at a wrong tv archive where it may have been sent in error- many tv stations around the world do seem to have very similar names. I know... I'm straw clutching .  |
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Post by Brad Phipps on Feb 3, 2012 3:56:02 GMT
On another site people are reminiscing about the Television Centre.Tales of "tapes stacked in lines down the edges of the corridor because the library wasn't big enough",and former or non employees getting in with any old bit of laminated card. How secure were these tapes? During the wiping period it must've been very hard to resist the urge to take them, OR take the risk, nick a tape and put 'wiped' on the form. I work in TV and it's really hard to erase stuff (although funnily enough that's part of my job). When we had a clear out of our archive a couple of years ago (NOTHING was Doctor Who, I checked, don't ask  I grabbed a few 405-line 2" quad tapes (the same used by Doctor Who) and a few 1" tapes for posterity. Just seemed wrong to biff them. I currently own the original TVNZ 1" broadcast tape of their own 25th anniversary special! |
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Post by John F Brayshaw on Feb 3, 2012 4:09:39 GMT
Although the odds are heavily against it and it is extremely unlikely, a lost Dr.Who episode maybe lurking around somewhere, forgotten, misfiled, in the wrong film can, perhaps even at a wrong tv archive where it may have been sent in error- m ::)any tv stations around the world do seem to have very similar names. I know... I'm straw clutching . Of course Dr. Who is lost but every single Blue Peter exists  |
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Post by erikborja on Feb 3, 2012 5:02:09 GMT
Well JF Blue Peters producer, Biddy Baxter, had a strict rule to keep all Blue Peter episodes
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Post by dennywilson on Feb 3, 2012 6:15:16 GMT
As I've pointed out in the past, it's been over 20 years since the last DW Lost Episodes were recovered from a former broadcaster - TOMB OF THE CYBERMEN. Lost episode was 1991, but the last Dr Who episode recovered from a broadcaster was 1995 (ABC in Australia returned an unedited copy of The Dominators 5). Just sayin'. Forgot about that. But didn't the BFI already hold an unedited FR Negative on Episode #5? |
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I grabbed a few 405-line 2" quad tapes (the same used by Doctor Who) and a few 1" tapes for posterity. Just seemed wrong to biff them.