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Post by Steven Sigel on Nov 30, 2007 6:03:34 GMT
For another two possible types that get discussed a bit, Dalek masterplan 2 was taken home by an employee, and A for andromeda was held onto by a private collector in full knowledge of what they had /: Maybe two completely unique events in the world, but perhaps not. I am personally tempted to attribute the misunderstanding (or whatever) about the web of fear most recently to JNTs 16mm footage from it coming onto the market. It could have been a case of chinese whispers perhaps? The difference is that while the guy who had "A For Andromeda" know what it was, it was no secret. Several people knew for years that he had it (I think Ian Levine tried to buy it in the 80s)... That's very different from suggesting that someone has something, but has kept it a complete secret.
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Post by Greg H on Nov 30, 2007 11:29:01 GMT
Not so different really. If im not mistaken the andromeda guy also had about 30 various 16mm b&w who prints as well. None known to be missing as far as im aware. But if he had stuff and let the cat out of the bag is it so completely impossible that someone else somewhere might have prints and has been more discreet over the years? B&w who HAS been given back by private collectors in the last decade. What if someone did have, say, web of fear and didnt want to break up their collection for any price, as they knew the it was unique? I do not believe such a scenario is impossible. But its all academic really anyway. The collector who had andromeda hung onto it for 30 years or so anyway
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Post by Daniel O'Brien on Nov 30, 2007 17:39:47 GMT
IIRC, he had the only surviving copy of 'Invasion of the Dinosaurs' episode 1.
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Post by Robert Manners on Nov 30, 2007 18:04:33 GMT
The BBC did think they had found the episode, but the tape turned out to be blank. Ron was that in around 1993 with the Roger K Barret hoax letters etc?
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Post by Steven Sigel on Dec 1, 2007 4:03:37 GMT
It's very different. I'm almost certain that it was two different people. Ian L would know for sure. The guy who had the Dr. Whos (including Dinosaurs) did return them As for "not breaking up a collection" - that's totally bogus - the BBC would just want to borrow the prints to copy. They've borrowed about a dozen of my prints and they're all back here now... There has been no known case of anyone hoarding something "secretly" that I'm aware of... Sadly, I think you are way too optimistic... Not so different really. If im not mistaken the andromeda guy also had about 30 various 16mm b&w who prints as well. None known to be missing as far as im aware. But if he had stuff and let the cat out of the bag is it so completely impossible that someone else somewhere might have prints and has been more discreet over the years? B&w who HAS been given back by private collectors in the last decade. What if someone did have, say, web of fear and didnt want to break up their collection for any price, as they knew the it was unique? I do not believe such a scenario is impossible. But its all academic really anyway. The collector who had andromeda hung onto it for 30 years or so anyway
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Post by mysticnitekatt on Dec 1, 2007 5:26:05 GMT
Interesting - has it ever been proved or disproved that Haisman and Lincoln HAD prints of the serial?
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Post by Greg H on Dec 1, 2007 5:56:39 GMT
Ok, not being rude, but how could you have a 'known' case of someone secretly hording something? Sorry but its a contradictory statement! If word had gotten out out it would be a bit like the chap who hoarded time meddler or A for andromeda etc etc etc. I dont know how openly the collectors in question broadcasted that information, or how much they wanted that to be public info frankly. As for letting the BBC borrow your print, of course it would matter to a selfish individual. It would be 'I have the only one in the world' versus 'I and anyone else can buy it in woolworths'. Spot the difference. There clearly is one. And someone stated that there are virtually no who prints in collections, fair enough but there is that chap who had around 30 or so, levine did list what he had and it was a lot and they didnt come from Levines collection. It's very different. I'm almost certain that it was two different people. Ian L would know for sure. The guy who had the Dr. Whos (including Dinosaurs) did return them As for "not breaking up a collection" - that's totally bogus - the BBC would just want to borrow the prints to copy. They've borrowed about a dozen of my prints and they're all back here now... There has been no known case of anyone hoarding something "secretly" that I'm aware of... Sadly, I think you are way too optimistic... Not so different really. If im not mistaken the andromeda guy also had about 30 various 16mm b&w who prints as well. None known to be missing as far as im aware. But if he had stuff and let the cat out of the bag is it so completely impossible that someone else somewhere might have prints and has been more discreet over the years? B&w who HAS been given back by private collectors in the last decade. What if someone did have, say, web of fear and didnt want to break up their collection for any price, as they knew the it was unique? I do not believe such a scenario is impossible. But its all academic really anyway. The collector who had andromeda hung onto it for 30 years or so anyway
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Post by Daniel O'Brien on Dec 1, 2007 8:12:10 GMT
Interesting - has it ever been proved or disproved that Haisman and Lincoln HAD prints of the serial? Sounds like typical fan myth/BS to me. The prints would likely have cost more than H&L got paid for the serial. I don't think even Terry Nation owned any film copies of his Dalek episodes.
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Post by Rich Cornock on Dec 1, 2007 9:17:26 GMT
sadly all these rumours get us no where, i havent heard any concrete proof of any missing Doctor Who episodes out there. Maybe its time as much energy was put into locating other missing programs which may get over looked in the scrabble to find Doctor Who episodes. Incidentally i think if there was some missing Doctor Who doing the rounds some of it would have turned up on You Tube by now as some of the missing Top of the Pops clips have.
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Post by Ash Stewart on Dec 1, 2007 11:06:21 GMT
Re: costs of film prints. IIRC the cost of striking a film print was more than Hartnell & Troughton were paid for starring in the episode. So, the chances of someone being given six complete prints would be a little hard to imagine to be true.
It's also worth bearing in mind, remember, that as far as I can recall, the only person who worked on the show that was given any film prints was Hartnell, and all he had was 12 minutes of one of the Dalek Invasion episodes.
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Post by mysticnitekatt on Dec 2, 2007 1:48:55 GMT
Re: costs of film prints. IIRC the cost of striking a film print was more than Hartnell & Troughton were paid for starring in the episode. So, the chances of someone being given six complete prints would be a little hard to imagine to be true. . Perhaps they got reel-to-reel video recordings?
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Post by Greg H on Dec 2, 2007 2:33:23 GMT
Didn't someone already ask them about this a while ago or am I mistaken?
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Post by Adrian Gregg on Dec 2, 2007 8:41:18 GMT
you can forget Reel to reel recordings. most (if not all) actors don't really give a damm to have copies of thier work, the next job will be the "one" and for clips apperaing on youtube mabey yes and most likley no. the 16mm collectors of TV ive met (some hundreds) have never, will never transfer any of thier prints to any digital-anologe formats EVER. Most have NO internet acsess and don't care for it. they have a passion for collecting and viewing film and i repect that (i'm one myself) most are single guys now in thier 60's and 70's and when they leave this world. most of thier collections get taken to the tip. FACT.. but do they have missing TV oh yes they do.. do they have dr who. nope. most telly collectors i know have variety,comedy,drama. kids shows are thin on the ground. and are mostly of the ITC type.
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Post by Rich Cornock on Dec 2, 2007 9:58:14 GMT
a bit of a race agianst time then. i wish the tv companys would put a bit more effort into program recovery
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Post by Steven Sigel on Dec 2, 2007 15:54:12 GMT
you can forget Reel to reel recordings. most (if not all) actors don't really give a damm to have copies of thier work, the next job will be the "one" and for clips apperaing on youtube mabey yes and most likley no. the 16mm collectors of TV ive met (some hundreds) have never, will never transfer any of thier prints to any digital-anologe formats EVER. Most have NO internet acsess and don't care for it. they have a passion for collecting and viewing film and i repect that (i'm one myself) most are single guys now in thier 60's and 70's and when they leave this world. most of thier collections get taken to the tip. FACT.. but do they have missing TV oh yes they do.. do they have dr who. nope. most telly collectors i know have variety,comedy,drama. kids shows are thin on the ground. and are mostly of the ITC type. ERM - check out ebay US and you'll see that a lot of film collectors have internet access. (Not all of course)... Also - your comment about "most are single guys now in thier 60's and 70's and when they leave this world. most of thier collections get taken to the tip." is not true. There certainly aresome collectors like that, but there are many younger collectors out there - in their 20s,30s and 40s... And many who are married. I'm in my 30s and I've been collecting since I was in my late teens. And many older collectors liquidate their collections before they go... I've bought several collections from older collectors...
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