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Post by Gerard Peck on Mar 2, 2011 10:50:43 GMT
Quick question - although not technically about missing episodes. I have read on a few sites that the negatives for The Professionals are missing. Is this correct? As I was rather hoping one day we could have this great series on blu ray!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2011 11:25:48 GMT
I doubt that they are but the repeats / releases always seem to be from poor or faded prints, which probably is a reason for thinking that. They probably can't be bothered to access the master material to improve matters, although if a blu-ray release were planned, they would have to. Presumably the series was shot 35mm even though most copies that get seen these days look like 16mm, hence the grainy quality.
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Post by Peter Stirling on Mar 2, 2011 11:39:39 GMT
I think the Professionals was shot on 16mm?
but was regarded as disposable telly hence nobody has really bothered about it technically and the grubby look made it what it is I thought.
Shame about the negs, as 16mm stuff like Inspector Morse
has now been blown up and archived on dependable 35mm making it look very nice indeed.
Ps they should be able to do something about Dempsey and Makeshift which I beleive was shot on 16mm and edited on
1 inch VTR and now looks very video noisy.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2011 12:19:38 GMT
Was The Professionals shot 16mm then, Peter? Not being a great fan or anything, I am no expert. I was assuming really as it was made at the same time and by the same production team as The New Avengers (which was 35mm). I suppose the newsreel feel of it suits but the 16mm negs could still look a lot better than they do, as The Sweeney restoration proves. The ones i've caught on repeats have often been quite faded / discoloured.
Maybe i'll have to revise my view of the series. I used to quite enjoy it in an undemanding way but seem to recall that the story was nearly always about protecting a visiting Arab diplomat or similar (i.e. a lack of much variation)!
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Post by Peter Stirling on Mar 2, 2011 15:44:32 GMT
I am only really going by the memory of the original transmissions
Laurence, the Professionals has always had a grubby gritty look about it (but I think it suits it ) compared to the Sweeney which always looked clean.
I think I may have lamented at the time that the ITC era of gorgous looking television seemed to be over, even the 70s New Avengers/ return of the saint always looked dull,flat and washed out to me.
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Post by Robert Belford on Mar 3, 2011 17:50:27 GMT
I reckon the difference is that in the 1960's they used slower filmstock, with brighter lighting and everything was lit with the classic Hollywood style of lighting (key, backlight and fill etc.). By the 1970's faster, but more grainy, stock was available, making shooting easier and more comfortable and a different style of lighting came into vogue, with a lot of soft bounced light - which is more 'natural' looking but tends to look grubbier and less glamorous. Interiors were shot on location instead of in a studio.
Things progressed for 16mm in the 1980's. Super16mm was recognised as an international standard in 1981 and I believe it wasn't until the early 1980's that British TV began using it. The bigger picture area gave better picture quality. Lab services and neg cutting for 16mm began to match those for 35mm in terms of cleanliness.
There have been accidents at labs over the years and there was major fire at Kay Film Labs in 1980. That is when all the negatives from the Mancunian film studios were lost. I would imagine many TV companies have their negs stored by labs? I wonder what else was lost in the fire at Kay?
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Post by Tony Walshaw on Mar 5, 2011 23:19:17 GMT
The first season of 'The Professionals' was on 35mm. The subsequent four seasons were on 16mm following the move from the hired base at Harefield Grove (Middlesex) to Lee International Studios at Wembley.
At this time, former 'Sweeney' crew members moved over from Euston to LWT, and The Pros took on more London street-based location filming.
The book 'The Professionals' by Bob Rocca (2009) is an in depth insight into the show and is highly recommended.
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Post by Steven Sigel on Mar 6, 2011 3:09:06 GMT
I had LPP low-fade 16mm prints of about 1/2 of the series at one point that I got from Australia. They were MUCH better looking than whatever they used to make the DVDs... I'm sort of sorry now that I sold them ...
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Post by gileshill on Mar 31, 2011 1:48:44 GMT
Things progressed for 16mm in the 1980's. Super16mm was recognised as an international standard in 1981 and I believe it wasn't until the early 1980's that British TV began using it. The bigger picture area gave better picture quality. Lab services and neg cutting for 16mm began to match those for 35mm in terms of cleanliness. The Darling Buds of May producers claim they were the first in the UK to use it. |
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Post by gileshill on Mar 31, 2011 1:54:49 GMT
Shame about the negs, as 16mm stuff like Inspector Morsehas now been blown up and archived on dependable 35mm making it look very nice indeed. The ITV 3 HD repeats don't have bounces on cuts so they can't have scanned the 16mm negatives. Does this mean they blew them up to 35mm prints for making HD telecines? |
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Post by Robert Belford on Mar 31, 2011 3:13:01 GMT
Maybe these days there are telecine machines that don't produce a bounce from the cement splices? I notice that 1980's VHS recordings of the BBC's Miss Marple have a very bad bounce at each cut but the most recent transmissions don't suffer from it anything like as much. I should imagine they also use software to stabilise film in general, eliminate weave and so on? The ITV 3 HD repeats don't have bounces on cuts so they can't have scanned the 16mm negatives. Does this mean they blew them up to 35mm prints for making HD telecines? |
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Post by nicadare on Jun 25, 2011 12:00:39 GMT
The quality of The Professionals is poor, they are noticeably grainy.
In my view The Avengers from around the 1967 era still has the best picture quality I have ever seen, and I am still watching on a Sony CRT 34" 4:3 ratio tube of which the latest plasma's and LCDs cannot compete because they cannot achieve the same contrast ratio.
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Post by Brian Denton on Jun 25, 2011 13:13:06 GMT
Quick question - although not technically about missing episodes. I have read on a few sites that the negatives for The Professionals are missing. Is this correct? As I was rather hoping one day we could have this great series on blu ray! Don't apologise for the thread Gerard - this has made for really interesting reading to an amateur like me ! |
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Post by Stephen Doran on Jun 26, 2011 9:13:18 GMT
Love the grainy film and im sure the VHS versions of episodes Close Quarters/Everest Was Also Conquered seemed better than the DVD versions. ;D
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Post by Steven Sigel on Jun 26, 2011 16:13:58 GMT
The prints I had were not grainy..
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