Burnclarke with an E

[Andy Howells]

Not sure if this should be in the TV or radio thread but I'm sure someone out there may have a bit more knowledge than me.

I believe it was remake of a Tony Hancock TV episode by Galton and Simpson starring Arthur Lowe as the Hancock type character and James Beck as the Sid James character.

A pilot was apparently recorded, then James Beck sadly died, a series was supposed to have been made, but Arthur Lowe refused to make it as he felt it was a bad idea without James Beck. Ultimately the pilot never got broadcast.

Wonder if anyone out there can confirm when it got recorded, was it TV or radio and ultimately (and I suspect highly likely) did it get junked?

A shame if it did because I think it would be an interesting piece to see for Hancock and Dad's Army fans.

I did email Galton and Simpson about it a few years ago but they gave me very little information about it (probably because they didnt have it).

Anyhow,any info would be greatly appreciated.

[Stuart Douglas]

According to the intro to this radio interview

(http://www.tonyhancock.org.uk/ham4art3.html)

with Galton and Simpson

"A pilot for the series was made in 1976 (The Economy Drive) with a few minor alterations, Galton and Simpson made Beck (playing Sid) Lowe's brother-in-law. Alan thought that Lowe was "sensational" as Hancock but sadly Beck died soon after the pilot was made and Lowe got "cold feet". Lowe reasoned that because of the untimely deaths of Hancock and Beck (not to mention Harry H. Corbett) the series was doomed and he would be the third to go (and it wasn't to be long before he did die)."

In another interview about the Lowe/Back remake, G&S said that

"Alan: People were always saying that we should remake some of the Hancocks, and we decided to do so five years after he died. We did a pilot of one of the Hancock scripts with Arthur Lowe. We rewrote the first page to try and explain the relationship between Arthur Lowe and James Beck who was playing Sid James and it went like a bomb.

Ray: Very good it was too.

Alan: He had so many of Hancock’s traits he could have done things like ‘The Lift’ and ‘The Blood Donor’ brilliantly. But James Beck died, just after the recording. There were just too many deaths in the family so to speak and Arthur decided not to do it."

I don't know if the pilot still exists (doubt it) but it was certainly never broadcast on TV.

Cheers

Stuart

[Lenny Clark]

Jun 19, 2008 10:24:48 GMT Stuart Douglas said:

A pilot for the series was made in 1976 (The Economy Drive) with a few minor alterations, Galton and Simpson made Beck (playing Sid) Lowe's brother-in-law. Alan thought that Lowe was "sensational" as Hancock but sadly Beck died soon after the pilot was made

Beck died in 1973.

[Deleted]

A fascinating window into a world that never quite was. I wonder if Andrew Martin knows any more about the archive status of this pilot? Presumably it's long gone, which would be a great shame.

[Stuart Douglas]

Jun 23, 2008 3:06:06 GMT Lenny Clark said:

Jun 19, 2008 10:24:48 GMT Stuart Douglas said:

A pilot for the series was made in 1976 (The Economy Drive) with a few minor alterations, Galton and Simpson made Beck (playing Sid) Lowe's brother-in-law. Alan thought that Lowe was "sensational" as Hancock but sadly Beck died soon after the pilot was made

Beck died in 1973.

That's a good point - that'll teach me to cut and paste


Cheers

Stuart

[Andrew Martin]

Jun 23, 2008 7:56:31 GMT @laurencepiper said:

A fascinating window into a world that never quite was. I wonder if Andrew Martin knows any more about the archive status of this pilot? Presumably it's long gone, which would be a great shame.

No sign of it in the archive I'm afraid.

[Deleted]

OK, thanks Andrew. I suppose it's possible it was just shot as a dry run (non-tx) to see if the formula worked and therefore it wouldn't have been made to be kept anyway (going on next to the real thing). It'd be fascinating to see such a thing though; I can very easily see Lowe in the Hancock role, blustering against authority at every turn, full of pretension and pomposity.

[William Martin]

It's the sort of thing that a producer or tech would keep as a door stop or something, a case of "I didn't think anyone would be interested in it" but it probably has gone the way of adam adamant pilot

[Andy Howells]

Thanks to everyone for all the valuable info and insight on this - I'm sure if it had existed it probably would have turned up by now - but, you cant always assume these things.

[Dave Homewood]

Jun 19, 2008 10:24:48 GMT Stuart Douglas said:

According to the intro to this radio interview

(http://www.tonyhancock.org.uk/ham4art3.html)

with Galton and Simpson

"A pilot for the series was made in 1976 (The Economy Drive) with a few minor alterations, Galton and Simpson made Beck (playing Sid) Lowe's brother-in-law. Alan thought that Lowe was "sensational" as Hancock but sadly Beck died soon after the pilot was made and Lowe got "cold feet". Lowe reasoned that because of the untimely deaths of Hancock and Beck (not to mention Harry H. Corbett) the series was doomed and he would be the third to go (and it wasn't to be long before he did die)."

There is some terrible research gone into that statement. Not only did, as pointed out, Jimmy Beck die on the 6th of August 1973, but Harry H. Corbett died on the 21st of March 1982, a fw weeks before Lowe died. Makes you wonder what else that site has wrong.

As for the recording date, I may have it somewhere, I'll look. I know that Stephen Lowe, Arthur's son, tried very hard to find a copy of Bunclarke, and don't quote me on this but I have it in the back of my mind that either Galton or Simpson's secretary reckoned one of them had the master tape but they wouldn't produce it. I may be getting mixed up with a different recording though. I know Stephen and I discussed the recording but that was some years ago.

I personally would have thought the humour in the Hancock scripts would have been far too goofy for Arthur Lowe. Lowe was a far better actor in my opinion.

Galton and Simpson teamed up with Lowe again in 1976 to make 'Car Along The Pass' which is superb, but no doubt the PC lot would call it racism today.

[Dave Homewood]

Sorry Andy, I've checked my Arthur Lowe files and cannot find the recording date, but I can tell you that Kay Beck also confirmed to me that Jimmy nor she was never given a copy of the recording.

To help pinpoint the recording date, if it really was not long before his death, then here are some dates I know that the Dad's Army cast were working to help eliminate possibilities and narrow it down. These are taken from a timeline I compiled a few years back.


21st – 31st May 1973
The cast and crew of Dad’s Army go to Thetford for location filming once again for Series Nine.

23rd May 1973
Location filming was done at The Grange Farm, Sapiston, Norfolk. I’m not sure of the exact sequence filmed here but it maybe the scene from We Know Our Onions where the Smith Gun is fired. Bill Pertwee bruised his thy here when he walked into the corner of a
van.

26th May 1973
Location Filming was done at Honnington School and Church Hall, Malting Row, Honnington, Norfolk. Scenes were for The Honourable Man and We Know Our Onions

3rd June 1973
The Man And The Hour was rehearsed from 2.00pm and recorded in the evening for BBC Radio 2 at the Paris Theatre Studio, London

4th – 7th June 1973
My British Buddy was rehearsed

7th June 1973
Museum Piece was rehearsed from 2.00pm and recorded in the evening for BBC Radio 2 at the Playhouse Theatre Studio, Northumberland Road, London

8th June 1973
My British Buddy was recorded at BBC Television Centre, London

11th – 13th June 1973
The Dad’s Army cast go to Brighton to film the episode We Know Our Onions

15th June 1973
The day that We Know Our Onions was scheduled to be recorded, but due to a strike the cast were forced to film the entire episode on location. So parts already filmed at
Thetford were coupled with new scenes filmed at Brighton on the 11th – 13th June

18th – 21st June 1973
The Deadly Attachment was rehearsed

21st June 1973
Command Decision and The Enemy Within The Gates were rehearsed from 4.00pm and recorded in the evening for BBC Radio 2 at the Paris Theatre Studio, London

22nd June 1973
The Deadly Attachment was recorded at BBC Television Centre, London

25th – 28th June 1973
The Royal Train was rehearsed

28th June 1973
Battle School was rehearsed from 2.00pm and recorded in the evening for BBC Radio 2 at the Paris Theatre Studio, London

29th June 1973
The Royal Train was recorded at BBC Television Centre, London

2nd – 7th July 1973 T
he Honourable Man was rehearsed

6th July 1973
The Battle of Godfrey’s Cottage and The Armoured Might of Lance Corporal Jones were rehearsed from 2.00pm and recorded in the evening for BBC Radio 2 at the Playhouse Theatre Studio, Northumberland Road, London

8th July 1973
The Honourable Man was recorded at BBC Television Centre, London

9th – 14th July 1973
Things That Go Bump In The Night was rehearsed

13th July 1973
Sgt Wilson’s Little Secret and A Stripe For Frazer were rehearsed from 4.15pm and recorded in the evening for BBC Radio 2 at the Playhouse Theatre Studio, Northumberland Road, London. This was the last time Jimmy Beck worked in Dad’s Army

14th July 1973
Whilst opening a fete that raised money for guide dogs, Jimmy Beck fell ill with stomach pains. On returning home he got worse, and his wife Kay rushed him the Queen Mary’s Hospital, Roehampton, London, where he slipped into a coma. He would never recover.

15th July 1973
Things That Go Bump In The Night was recorded at BBC Television Centre, London without Jimmy Beck in the studio scenes. The script was hurriedly adapted to work around him

17th - 21st July 1973
The Recruit was rehearsed with altered script to accommodate the loss of Jimmy Beck

20th July 1973
The Showing Up of Corporal Jones and The Loneliness of the Long Distance Walker were rehearsed from 2.00pm and recorded in the evening for BBC Radio 2 at the Playhouse Theatre Studio, Northumberland Road, London. Due to the illness of James Beck, the radio actor Graham Stark was hastily brought in to cover the role of Walker in both episodes

21st July 1973
John Laurie became Godfather to Ian lavender’s son Sam at his Christening

22nd July 1973
The Recruit was recorded at BBC Television Centre, London

6th of August 1973
James Beck passed away

[Andy Howells]

Thanks for the info there Dave, as ever - priceless! Where did you get all those dates???

It does confirm a lot of information and also dispel a lot of rumours about Jimmy's departure from Dad's Army. Its often referred that Graham Stark replaced Jimmy as Walker in the radio series when Jimmy died which isnt totally true and its obvious Graham kindly stepped in while Jimmy was seriously ill. It was obviously a difficult time for all concerned but also a very productive time for the cast, recording the first episodes of the radio series and ultimately the final shows of the 1973 series.

Jimmy Beck had had quite a productive year in 73 as he had also completed a series of Romany Jones, (possibly early 73?) so I would imagine Burnclarke would certainly have been recorded before the Dad's Army filming.

Unfortunately as time passes I think peoples memories of dates and times become rather clouded, this is quite evident with lots of shows that have gone out over the years and I've seen several books (in some cases, written by people who should know better) that have referred to Jimmy's death at varying ages between 38 and 45 to dates from 1969 to 76.

I would like to think a copy of Burnclarke does survive, if only from a curiousity angle, I think Arthur would probably have handled Hancock's scripts quite well, but he would have added so much he would have probably made them his own rather than an impression of Hancock. I think the same would have been for Jimmy in the Sid James character, however for the moment I guess we'll never know though the only clue was it must have been good enough if the production crew wanted to do it as a TV series.

[Andy Howells]

On the subject of Jimmy Beck does anyone know if The Troubleshooters episode "The Price Of a Bride" from 1970 still exists?

[Dave Homewood]

Jun 28, 2008 14:19:56 GMT Andy Howells said:

Thanks for the info there Dave, as ever - priceless!

No problem mate, I'm glad to help.

Where did you get all those dates???

Lots of research in lots of places. Some first hand from diaries.

It does confirm a lot of information and also dispel a lot of rumours about Jimmy's departure from Dad's Army. Its often referred that Graham Stark replaced Jimmy as Walker in the radio series when Jimmy died which isnt totally true and its obvious Graham kindly stepped in while Jimmy was seriously ill.

Yes, in some cases there is a lot of assumption made by people. I've talked with Michael Knowles and Jimmy perry about it and yes Graham Stark was brought in to cover during whatthey thought would be a temporary crisis. He was basically just an actor who worked for BBC radio and was free on the recording dates, they never really auditioned him or anything as far as I can tell. Michael said they knew he wasn't right for the part and when Jimmy died they set about finding a proper replacement. I personally cannot think of a better replacement that Larry Martyn, his voice and mannerisms were perfect and he also brought a little more to the character. The fact that he was also very good friends with Jimmy and Kay Beck before Jimmy's death is even more touching that he got to replace his late friend. I wish someone had interviewed Larry about the role before he died.

It was obviously a difficult time for all concerned but also a very productive time for the cast, recording the first episodes of the radio series and ultimately the final shows of the 1973 series.

Indeed, there was a lot going on and my dates don't list other appearances that the cast no doubt were making as guests on other shows. I know Arthur Lowe was very busy that year for xample, as was John laurie. The show was really at full steam ahead in 1973 and they were not just household names but in much demand for TV, radio, adverts, some films, etc in their own rights as actors. No doubt there were lots of one off gigs too like openign fetes, which is what Jimmy was doing when he got ill. So it must have been somewhat stressful, and in some ways you can't blame Jimmy, an actor who's speny years strugglling and then suddenly he had hit the bigtime, to be drinking a little too much to unwind. The public were never really made aware at the time but it was basicly the drink that killed him.

Jimmy Beck had had quite a productive year in 73 as he had also completed a series of Romany Jones, (possibly early 73?) so I would imagine Burnclarke would certainly have been recorded before the Dad's Army filming.

I am fairly sure I have all the recording dayes and other data on the Romany Jones series. If you want I could try to find them, but it may take some effort as I don't recall exactly where I've stashed them.

Unfortunately as time passes I think peoples memories of dates and times become rather clouded, this is quite evident with lots of shows that have gone out over the years and I've seen several books (in some cases, written by people who should know better) that have referred to Jimmy's death at varying ages between 38 and 45 to dates from 1969 to 76.

It doesn't help when the press and authors write misinformation and those reading it believe it and perpetuate it. There have been a lot of myths created by the media surrounding Dad's Army and I know they've bothered people like Bill Pertwee and Jimmy Perry. I tried to dispel a lot of the myths when i was writing Platoon Attention and whenhelping the other authors write books, hopefully some of them are now dead and buried.

I would like to think a copy of Burnclarke does survive, if only from a curiousity angle,

I'm sure I read that all of the tapes in Galton and Simpson's own personal collections have been checked for lost stuff (probably by Steptoe and Hancock fans) so sadly if they didn't keep them, we can only hope maybe an editor or director kept a copy.

I think Arthur would probably have handled Hancock's scripts quite well, but he would have added so much he would have probably made them his own rather than an impression of Hancock.

Indeed, I've seen him in many varying roles and he was always superb. He would have brought so much more to it than Tony Hancock dd I think. I've never been convinced that Tony Hancock was as brilliant as some people think.

I think the same would have been for Jimmy in the Sid James character, however for the moment I guess we'll never know though the only clue was it must have been good enough if the production crew wanted to do it as a TV series.

I wish they'd turned Car Along The Pass into a series. Henry Duckworth was better than Potter (though Potter was still good).