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Post by Steven Sigel on Jul 11, 2003 12:48:26 GMT
I recall there was some discussion a while back about the animation segment from the "How not to be seen" episode of Monty Pythons flying circus with Jesus on a phone pole and Satan popping out of the earth whch is missing from the DVD release.
Is this clip considered missing completely (e.g. is there a copy in the archives?) or is it just intentionally left out?
I've just come across a 16mm telerecording which has this clip and wanted to know if it is needed ...
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Post by Mike S on Jul 11, 2003 15:07:55 GMT
Cut from the original show (or maybe just for its first repeat?), but left in for American screenings. A few frames are left in during the 30-second recap at the end, suggesting the team were fully aware of its troublesomeness.
Offer a copy to the BBC, and to the BFI, and to Roger Saunders at Python (Monty) Pictures, not to mention Terry Jones...but for God's sake make sure you keep lots of back-up copies for yourself. Just to ensure that there are plenty of bootlegged copies knocking around and people get to see them!
What happens in the animation? I've always wondered.
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Post by Steven Sigel on Jul 11, 2003 20:36:34 GMT
I'll ask Christine at the BBC if they need it...
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Post by Mike S on Jul 11, 2003 22:08:41 GMT
Just bear in mind that, by handing it over to The Authorities, you're not necessarily bequeathing it to the nation - chances are they'll say 'hmm, quite an interesting find' and it'll be locked away in a vault because nobody can get the rights to show it anywhere. That's the irony.
So make sure you've got copies for yourself before you go anywhere near a postbox!
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Post by Steven Sigel on Jul 11, 2003 23:18:49 GMT
Hi Mike,
I'm not particularly worried about the print -- all the prints (Terry Scott shows) I've sent to the BBC have come back in perfect shape....
Someone told me that there is at least one more print of this floating around in Australia... So it doesn't sound like this print is all that rare...
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Post by Matthew K Sharp on Jul 12, 2003 7:18:45 GMT
Someone told me that there is at least one more print of this floating around in Australia... So it doesn't sound like this print is all that rare... I had a videotape copy of this b/w film print supplied in error recently (instead of an episode of One Step Beyond). There's a tiny little extra piece in the opening sketch (A line from Cleese "Finally, these tactless references to leprosy and terminal cancer...") omitted (about 5 seconds), as well as the crucifixes as telegraph poles / devil animation at the end of Crackpot Religions (about 35 seconds). Oddly, there's a chunk of the Crelm toothpaste animation missing - it ends on the line "Crelm toothpaste goes on to win with 100% protection" and cuts to the start of the Railway Timetables Murder sketch. Does the print you have have this same omission, Steven? MKS |
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Post by Mike S on Jul 12, 2003 8:37:12 GMT
Blimey, it gets better and better.
They should track a copy down for MBW.
Does anyone know how these alternate versions came about? Why would an overseas print be struck from a looser edit?
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Post by Matthew K Sharp on Jul 12, 2003 9:19:11 GMT
Does anyone know how these alternate versions came about? Why would an overseas print be struck from a looser edit? That's what I'd like to know. Presumably the edits to the master VT were made quite close to transmission - both are obviously censorship decisions - but the 16mm for BBC Worldwide must have been made well beforehand. I think these episode were recorded quite far in advance or transmission. For those of you who'd like to see what you've been missing, try www.kirseval.com/python24. MKS |
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Post by Steven Sigel on Jul 12, 2003 13:32:38 GMT
I'll check the print again when I get a chance to see if the Leprosy/ Cancer bit, and the Crelm edit are there as well... I'm sure they are there -- the screen shots you have look identical (including the time-life tag at the end) so I would assume that they are the same...
Matthew -- do you have a video tape copy of this, or an actual 16mm kinescope?
It's interesting, the print I have says "Chinese Ad Men" on the leader as well - I wonder if it was syndicated that way...
Another intereting datapoint -- the time life prints of other BBC shows were edited oddly as well -- the Dr. Who episodes (Tom Baker - from Robot to Invasion of Time) which were shown in the US (incessently for years before they finally got some other episodes) were the Time Life versions which were badly edited, had Howard Da Silva doing voice overs describing the previous and next episodes. They also had a teaser at the start of ep 1 (which usually gave away the whole story) and then "scenes from next episode" at the end.....
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Post by Matthew K Sharp on Jul 12, 2003 13:43:27 GMT
Just a VT copy. It came to me on BetacamSP, and I took a DVCam copy for reference before the Beta went back. (Officially we were somewhat miffed that we'd paid for 3 eps of One Step Beyond and only got 2, and so returned the tape; unofficially I was much happier with what we were sent...)
Of course, the big question is why TimeLife were distributing b/w prints in the US in the 1970s? I thought the US was fully color by then.
MKS
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Post by Steven Sigel on Jul 12, 2003 14:20:42 GMT
Hi Matthew --
That's a very good question -- the US pretty much went all color by 1965/66 -- so it doesn't make much sense. Did Time-Life distribute prints elsewhere in the world?
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Post by Steven Sigel on Jul 12, 2003 22:48:55 GMT
I checked out the print again, and sure enough the "leprosy/cancer" line is there, and the crelm edit is present (there's no splice in the print, so it was omitted intentionally)....
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Post by Mike S on Jul 12, 2003 23:39:16 GMT
Strange that everyone bangs on about the cancer/gangrene thing, but never this cut. Which it was obviously a reference to (or swipe at) in the first place. Odd that they mention leprosy twice though.
Also, if it was a overseas-version-printed-before the cuts-were-enforced, why did it still have the snipped bits in the 30-second montage? (Because they *knew* it was going to be cut, presumably...)
Anyway, when is Missing Believed Wiped? Who is it we contact to suggest stuff?
Although, to be honest, I think it's better suited to inclusion in a proper Flying Circus DVD collection, should that ever appear.
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Post by Mike S on Jul 13, 2003 0:56:35 GMT
Did Christine Slattery express an interest in it by the way?
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Post by Steven Sigel on Jul 13, 2003 0:57:52 GMT
I haven't heard back from Christine yet -- I emailed her on Friday - so she probably hasn't seen the message yet...
I'll let you know what she says...
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