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Post by timjolly on Mar 13, 2022 23:49:16 GMT
3 Qs on ROT….
1. Does anyone know why BritBox doesn’t have this at all?
2. Everyone always talks about WHY Marco Polo hasn’t turned up, but I wonder why the missing two aren’t talked about more? And how likely they are to turn up..
3. Is there a specific reason why telesnaps don’t exist at all?
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Post by Michael D. Kimpton on Mar 15, 2022 19:15:42 GMT
1. Could be an oversight.
2. It IS possible they'll turn up somewhere. ROT 4 and 5 weren't part of the Cyprus batch because they were apparently in a storage area that was destroyed during the Civil War in Cyprus. When Paul Vanezis contacted Cyprus, he was informed that Episodes 1, 3-4 of Aztecs, All the Sensorites episodes and Episodes 1-3 and 6 of ROT were there. It was later established that Marco Polo and Keys of Marinus were not part of the destroyed batch as they'd gone to Hong Kong or somewhere else before the other place was destroyed. Episode 6 is in better condition because another copy was found in the UK by a private film collector who came forward with it before the Cyprus prints were recovered. So the Episode 6 they got from Cyprus was thankfully a duplicate print.
3. At that time, I believe only certain members of the team would buy Tele-Snaps of stories they did. Waris Hussein bought and kept the snaps of Marco Polo. Episode 4 was snapped, but Waris didn't direct that episode and so didn't buy them. It could simply be that snaps of Reign don't exist because none were ordered. It wasn't until Innes Lloyd became producer that Tele-Snaps became a regular thing.
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Post by Jon Preddle on Mar 15, 2022 20:15:36 GMT
Tele-snaps were useful to directors to showcase their camera shots and angles / sets / casting, which is why most of the ones from Seasons 1 and 2 that have turned up over the years have been owned by the directors. These were *probably* ordered in advance from Cura. It's likely that Hirsch didn't order any, so they don't exist.
(The Crusade snaps and some others had also been held at the production office, but these were saved from being thrown out. Two sets were of stories directed by Douglas Camfield, which may explain where they came from.)
The big books of snaps later found at Caversham had been held at the production office; they had been ordered by Innes Lloyd and later Peter Bryant.
Snaps were not so useful to actors, as they are static images with no sound; IIRC, the only set that has turned up that was held by an actor was The Moonbase?
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Post by timjolly on Mar 16, 2022 11:43:12 GMT
Thanks for the responses guys. I can only imagine that Reign isn’t on BritBox because of perhaps “animation rights” or similar preventing it from being shown as it’s literally the only incomplete story not appearing at all.
I would hope when the S2 Blueray Boxset is done that at the very least the Crusade is given two episodes of B&W animation. Shame no photos of Ronald Pickup existing…
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Post by andrew shutt on Mar 17, 2022 11:44:25 GMT
I would hope when the S2 Blueray Boxset is done that at the very least the Crusade is given two episodes of B&W animation. Shame no photos of Ronald Pickup existing… No chance of the Crusade's missing episodes getting animated for a season 2 blu ray collection ,the budget for a S2 set will be streched as it is with restoring the existing episodes without paying out for animating 2 of the most tricky episodes to do |
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Post by John Wall on Mar 17, 2022 12:04:10 GMT
I would hope when the S2 Blueray Boxset is done that at the very least the Crusade is given two episodes of B&W animation. Shame no photos of Ronald Pickup existing… No chance of the Crusade's missing episodes getting animated for a season 2 blu ray collection ,the budget for a S2 set will be streched as it is with restoring the existing episodes without paying out for animating 2 of the most tricky episodes to do With the exception of the Time Meddler - which is perfectly watchable - Season 2 episodes are pretty good imho. |
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Post by barneyhall on Mar 18, 2022 1:56:42 GMT
Sadly the odds on seeing a crusade animation are as low as they could be and most certainly would never be possible in the budget for one of the collections. It has literally everything against it. It has what is considered to be unsavoury depictions of other cultures and races as well as black face so what animation style to do these in would be a pr nightmare. Also has multiple characters in different costumes and a wide range of sets. Then to boot its not a well loved story and is a historical (nothing wrong with it but it's never going to sell like a dalek, cyber or yeti animation) on top of that currently the animation project is without a financial backer and if it was I just don't think this will be on the list of garunteed returns on investment.The only slither of chance would be is them doing a similar cheaper animation like they did with Web and frankly I'd rather the didn't. While it remains un animated there's a chance technology will change and doing a proper animation may become more viable in the future. If they made a cheaper web style animation that's what we would be stuck with forever. Don't get me wrong I'd love a proper crusade animation. I'm just saddled with being boringly practically minded.
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Post by timjolly on Mar 18, 2022 2:34:23 GMT
Sadly the odds on seeing a crusade animation are as low as they could be and most certainly would never be possible in the budget for one of the collections. It has literally everything against it. It has what is considered to be unsavoury depictions of other cultures and races as well as black face so what animation style to do these in would be a pr nightmare. Also has multiple characters in different costumes and a wide range of sets. Then to boot its not a well loved story and is a historical (nothing wrong with it but it's never going to sell like a dalek, cyber or yeti animation) on top of that currently the animation project is without a financial backer and if it was I just don't think this will be on the list of garunteed returns on investment.The only slither of chance would be is them doing a similar cheaper animation like they did with Web and frankly I'd rather the didn't. While it remains un animated there's a chance technology will change and doing a proper animation may become more viable in the future. If they made a cheaper web style animation that's what we would be stuck with forever. Don't get me wrong I'd love a proper crusade animation. I'm just saddled with being boringly practically minded. Similar to ROT I’d hope that they would go the route of just animating the two missing episodes in B&W (which would help alleviate the issue with “coloured faces”. Rather than a colour version. Saying that I’m sure it would be amazing with all the varied costumes. Speaking of difficulties and costumes, it might not be one high up on peoples wants. However it can’t be ignored that by animating just these two missing will complete a season and would make a Blu-ray S2 release all the better. The less said about a “wish version” of the Crusade like WOF the better as after watching the Invasion version of characters such as the Brigadier it only makes me despise the WOF animation even more. What’s worse is someone paid for that! Ah well, here’s hoping ep3 turns up so it can be relegated to history. Considering ROT didn’t even have any telesnaps surely the Crusade would be an easier project? |
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Post by John Wall on Mar 20, 2022 19:18:47 GMT
We’ve expended quite a lot of electronic ink on the Crusade but the two missing episodes have telesnaps. Let’s keep everything crossed 👍
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Post by Natalie Sinead on Mar 21, 2022 7:11:45 GMT
I agree with upthread - if you want a way to upset the Arab-Islamic World, releasing "The Crusade" would be it...
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Post by Graham Hatton on Mar 21, 2022 10:21:36 GMT
Hi All
Long time lurker, newbie member here.
Regarding the Reign of Terror, it seems odd it is not available on any digital platforms. The only way to get it is on DVD. Is this the only animation with such a limited release?
Thanks
Graham
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2023 15:36:46 GMT
The only chances episodes 4 and 5 show up if we find them in Ethiopia, Thailand, and Nigeria, or if private collectors have them. Seeing how the private collector's copies of 3 and 6 are better quality than the Cyprus versions, maybe 4 and 5 still survive in private collections.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2023 15:43:14 GMT
The only chances episodes 4 and 5 show up if we find them in Ethiopia, Thailand, and Nigeria, or if private collectors have them. Seeing how the private collector's copies of 3 and 6 are better quality than the Cyprus versions, maybe 4 and 5 still survive in private collections. Also, I suspect the private collector's of episodes 3 and 6, which were returned to the BBC in 1985 and 1982, respectively, are the ex-Sierra Leone prints. That's because for Marco Polo and The Reign of Terror, records show that only the Sierra Leone prints were Stored Field, the rest were Suppressed Field. But then again, the prints coulds also be the ex-enterprise prints as the BBC Enterprise always used Stored Field. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2023 2:34:30 GMT
The only chances episodes 4 and 5 show up if we find them in Ethiopia, Thailand, and Nigeria, or if private collectors have them. Seeing how the private collector's copies of 3 and 6 are better quality than the Cyprus versions, maybe 4 and 5 still survive in private collections. Also, I suspect the private collector's of episodes 3 and 6, which were returned to the BBC in 1985 and 1982, respectively, are the ex-Sierra Leone prints. That's because for Marco Polo and The Reign of Terror, records show that only the Sierra Leone prints were Stored Field, the rest were Suppressed Field. But then again, the prints coulds also be the ex-enterprise prints as the BBC Enterprise always used Stored Field. Not to mention that Sierra Leone was the one of the last countries to return Hartnell prints to the BBC, doing do in 1974. |
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