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Post by ianphillips on Jul 8, 2016 3:27:59 GMT
So recently I got my hands on some Loose Cannon reconstructions (which are awesome by the way) and I've seen anout six so far, but as I've been watching them I have noticed certain pieces of incidental music that I really like. I have the 50th anniversary music collection cd and they aren't on there. I'm wondering if, and if so, where these are available for purchase. I am specifically insterested in the self titled "The Macra Theme" from the Macra Terror which plays pretty much any time the Macra are on screen (specific examples are the cliffhangers for episodes one and two), and the music from Fury from the Deep. Any ideas?
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Post by Liam Masters on Jul 8, 2016 13:30:32 GMT
Sadly, not much music from the 60's episodes survives and both examples you want are both Dudley Simpson compositions and very little of his music survives. Although, the "Macra Theme" survives and has only been released on the 11 disk 50th anniversary soundtrack as "The Macra Terror (Incidental Music Excerpt)" and only one piece of music from Fury has been released; "Mr Oak and Mr Quill" (music from the well known censor clip of Maggie Harris being gassed) which has been released as part of "Doctor Who at the BBC Radiophonic Workshop Volume 1: The Early Years 1963–1969" and the aforementioned 50th anniversary soundtrack. The best release for music from 60's episodes that survives is the 11 disk 50th anniversary soundtrack but it was sadly a limited release, the whole thing's probably on YouTube though.
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Post by ianphillips on Jul 13, 2016 4:01:49 GMT
So is there like a complete list of missing music somewhere because if there is then I would be interested in seeing it. Also, do you know whether the music is missing based on serial, or is it randomly interspersed? Example: Would all of the music from say The Myth Makers be completely missing and all of the music from the Abominable Snowmen be intact, or would both serials be missing music?
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Post by Liam Masters on Jul 13, 2016 7:25:20 GMT
So is there like a complete list of missing music somewhere because if there is then I would be interested in seeing it. Also, do you know whether the music is missing based on serial, or is it randomly interspersed? Example: Would all of the music from say The Myth Makers be completely missing and all of the music from the Abominable Snowmen be intact, or would both serials be missing music? I can only list which have music that survives and I hope that gives an idea as to just how much of the music is sadly missing. All below info is based on what's been released and the booklet for the 50th anniversary 11 disk soundtrack which states which music tapes survive. The Daleks (complete) - Tristram Cary The Daleks' Master Plan (complete) - Tristram Cary The Gunfighters (complete) - Tristram Cary The Underwater Menace (incomplete, only 1 cue has been released: The Fish People) - Dudley Simpson The Macra Terror (incomplete, only 2 cues has been released; Chromophone Band & The "Macra Theme") - Dudley Simpson Fury from the Deep (unclear, only 1 cue released: Mr Oak and Mr Quill) - Dudley Simpson The Invasion (complete, although only a few cues have been released; The Dark Side of the Moon, The Company, Brigadier Lethbridge-Stewart & Mysteries) - Don Harper The Seeds of Death (unclear, only 3 cues have been released; Titles, Moon Control & Ice Warriors Music) - Dudley Simpson The Silurians (Complete) - Carey Blyton The Mind of Evil (unclear, only 4 cues have been released; The Master's Theme, Hypnosis Music, Dover Castle & Keller Machine Theme) - Dudley Simpson The Claws of Axos (incomplete, 1 cue: The Axons Approach) - Dudley Simpson The Mutants (complete) - Tristram Cary Carnival of Monsters (incomplete, only episode 1) - Dudley Simpson Frontier in Space (incomplete, only episodes 1&2) - Dudley Simpson Death to the Daleks (complete) - Cary Blyton Planet of the Spiders (incomplete, only episode 2) - Dudley Simpson Revenge of the Cybermen (complete) - Carey Blyton Terror of the Zygons (complete) - Geoffrey Burgon The Android Invasion (incomplete, only episodes 3&4) - Dudley Simpson The Seeds of Doom (complete) - Geoffrey Burgon The Sun Makers (complete) - Dudley Simpson The Invasion of Time (incomplete, only episodes 3&4) - Dudley Simpson All music from the 80's episodes survive except for Mindwarp. I hope that answers all that you wanted to know about the music. |
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Post by ianphillips on Jul 13, 2016 17:13:37 GMT
I can't say that I've seen all of the pre-80s episodes or even all of the episodes on this list, but I can say that I am glad the two with my favorite music (at least that I've heard) Fury and Macra survive at least in part. I also know that approximately 23 seconds of the inflatable chair theme from Terror of the Autons survives because during the actual episode it plays in otherwise complete silence. BBC Worldwide actually uploaded the clip it can be heard in. www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXrAK6sUZ_0 |
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Post by Sue Butcher on Sept 18, 2016 10:24:16 GMT
I hope one day a producer will hire some classical musicians and rerecord Dudley Simpson's soundtrack music from Seeds of Death, Space Pirates, and War Games. The music from these three would go together well on a CD.
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Post by ianphillips on Jun 9, 2017 18:14:17 GMT
Does anyone know whether the incidental music used in serials like The Edge of Destruction and The Rescue still exists?
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Post by Liam Masters on Jun 9, 2017 20:57:05 GMT
The Edge of Destruction is just stock music which is all still available and The Rescue is just tracked from Tristram Cary's music to the first Dalek story.
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Post by Greg H on Jun 9, 2017 21:45:47 GMT
The Edge of Destruction is just stock music which is all still available and The Rescue is just tracked from Tristram Cary's music to the first Dalek story. Isn't quite a lot of it stock music that was recycled here and there? |
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Post by ianphillips on Aug 1, 2017 1:55:26 GMT
So is there like a complete list of missing music somewhere because if there is then I would be interested in seeing it. Also, do you know whether the music is missing based on serial, or is it randomly interspersed? Example: Would all of the music from say The Myth Makers be completely missing and all of the music from the Abominable Snowmen be intact, or would both serials be missing music? I can only list which have music that survives and I hope that gives an idea as to just how much of the music is sadly missing. All below info is based on what's been released and the booklet for the 50th anniversary 11 disk soundtrack which states which music tapes survive. The Daleks (complete) - Tristram Cary The Daleks' Master Plan (complete) - Tristram Cary The Gunfighters (complete) - Tristram Cary The Underwater Menace (incomplete, only 1 cue has been released: The Fish People) - Dudley Simpson The Macra Terror (incomplete, only 2 cues has been released; Chromophone Band & The "Macra Theme") - Dudley Simpson Fury from the Deep (unclear, only 1 cue released: Mr Oak and Mr Quill) - Dudley Simpson The Invasion (complete, although only a few cues have been released; The Dark Side of the Moon, The Company, Brigadier Lethbridge-Stewart & Mysteries) - Don Harper The Seeds of Death (unclear, only 3 cues have been released; Titles, Moon Control & Ice Warriors Music) - Dudley Simpson The Silurians (Complete) - Carey Blyton The Mind of Evil (unclear, only 4 cues have been released; The Master's Theme, Hypnosis Music, Dover Castle & Keller Machine Theme) - Dudley Simpson The Claws of Axos (incomplete, 1 cue: The Axons Approach) - Dudley Simpson The Mutants (complete) - Tristram Cary Carnival of Monsters (incomplete, only episode 1) - Dudley Simpson Frontier in Space (incomplete, only episodes 1&2) - Dudley Simpson Death to the Daleks (complete) - Cary Blyton Planet of the Spiders (incomplete, only episode 2) - Dudley Simpson Revenge of the Cybermen (complete) - Carey Blyton Terror of the Zygons (complete) - Geoffrey Burgon The Android Invasion (incomplete, only episodes 3&4) - Dudley Simpson The Seeds of Doom (complete) - Geoffrey Burgon The Sun Makers (complete) - Dudley Simpson The Invasion of Time (incomplete, only episodes 3&4) - Dudley Simpson All music from the 80's episodes survive except for Mindwarp. I hope that answers all that you wanted to know about the music. It's been about a year since I started this thread so I hate to revive it now, but I've always wondered: why are some of the stories like Fury from the Deep and The Mind of Evil unclear? Surely if they either have the tracks or they do not have the tracks. Has it just not been announced and if not then why are those stories specifically unclear when every other serial is either complete, incomplete, or missing? |
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Post by Liam Masters on Aug 1, 2017 5:46:39 GMT
It's been about a year since I started this thread so I hate to revive it now, but I've always wondered: why are some of the stories like Fury from the Deep and The Mind of Evil unclear? Surely if they either have the tracks or they do not have the tracks. Has it just not been announced and if not then why are those stories specifically unclear when every other serial is either complete, incomplete, or missing? It has been stated that some tapes containing music from those stories survive but it is unclear as to just how much of the score actually survives beyond what has been released. |
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Post by Richard Marple on Aug 1, 2017 12:33:42 GMT
There was a release of the stock music used on Tomb Of The Cybermen, according to the info text.
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Post by ianphillips on Aug 1, 2017 17:56:53 GMT
It's been about a year since I started this thread so I hate to revive it now, but I've always wondered: why are some of the stories like Fury from the Deep and The Mind of Evil unclear? Surely if they either have the tracks or they do not have the tracks. Has it just not been announced and if not then why are those stories specifically unclear when every other serial is either complete, incomplete, or missing? It has been stated that some tapes containing music from those stories survive but it is unclear as to just how much of the score actually survives beyond what has been released. So basically we know that the score is not fully complete, but we don't how incomplete it is. |
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Post by Liam Masters on Aug 1, 2017 20:42:29 GMT
Might just be easier to copy out the info about tapes from the 50th anniversary soundtracks booklet...
We do have all the theme music masters.
The Daleks / The Daleks' Master Plan / The Gunfighters (Tristram Cary, 1963-1966) - Tristram retained masters.
The Underwater Menace (Dudley Simpson. 1967) - recorded at the BBC Radiophonic Workshop; incomplete copy retained.
The Macra Terror (Dudley Simpson, 1967) - recorded at the BBC Radiophonic Workshop; incomplete copy retained.
Fury from the Deep (Dudley Simpson, 1968) - recorded at the BBC Radiophonic Workshop; incomplete copy retained.
The Invasion (Don Harper, 1968) - Don retained a 7.5ips 1/4" tape copy.
The Seeds of Death (Dudley Simpson, 1968) - copy retained in RWS archive.
The Silurians (Carey Blyton, 1970) - Carey retained a 7.5.ips 1/4" tape copy.
The Mind of Evil (Dudley Simpson, 1971) - recorded at the BBC Radiophonic Workshop; copy retained by Brian Hodgson.
The Claws of Axos (Dudley Simpson, 1971) - recorded at the BBC Radiophonic Workshop; only one cue survives as part of an EMS Synthesiser demo record.
The Sea Devils (Malcolm Clarke / BBC Radio Phonic Workshop, 1972) - masters retained at RWS.
The Mutants (Tristram Cary, 1972) - Tristram retained masters.
Carnival of Monsters (Dudley Simpson, 1973) - The original sessions tape for episode 1 was discovered in Delia Derbyshire's attic after her death. As such it is without the synthesiser overdubs that were added later. Nothing else survives.
Frontier in Space (Dudley Simpson, 1973) - a copy of the music for episodes 1 & 2 was found on the end of the archived effects tape for this story. Episodes 3-6 do no survive.
Death to the Daleks (Carey Blyton, 1974) - Carey retained a 7.5.ips 1/4" tape copy.
Planet of the Spiders (Dudley Simpson, 1974) - Part of the original session tape for part 2 was found, bizarrely, at the Imperial College Television Studio in 2003. As with Carnival of Monsters, it is without synthesiser overdubs which were added later.
Revenge of the Cybermen (Carey Blyton, 1974) - Carey retained 7.5.ips 1/4" tapes.
Terror of the Zygons (Geoffrey Burgon, 1975) - Geoffrey retained a 1/4" tape.
The Android Invasion (Dudley Simpson, 1975) - The music for parts 3 & 4 was found, mislablled, in the BBC Radiophonic Workshop archive. Episodes 1 & 2 are still missing.
The Seeds of Death (Geoffrey Burgon, 1976) - Geoffrey retained a 1/4" tape.
The Sun Makers (Dudley Simpson, 1977) - Complete; the master tapes of this music were held with the sound effects in the BBC Radiophonic Workshop archive.
The Invasion of Time (Dudley Simpson, 1978) - A copy of the music for parts 3 & 4 only was found on the end of the archived effects tape for this story.
All of the above are monophonic recordings.
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Post by Liam Masters on Aug 1, 2017 21:13:40 GMT
The Leisure Hive to Revelation of the Daleks (Various Composers, BBC Radiophonic Workshop, 1980-1985) - The music for all episodes survive as original mono masters and/or Enterprise copies. Frontios (Paddy Kingsland, 1984) and Attack of the Cybermen (Malcolm Clarke, 1985) were uniquely recorded in stereo.
The Trial of a Time Lord parts 1-4 (aka The Mysterious Planet) (Dominic Glynn, 1986) - Masters held by Dominic Glynn; copies in the BBC Enterprises Library.
The Trial of a Time Lord part 5-8 (aka Mindwarp) (Richard Hartley, 1986) - No copy survives. The original multitrack for episode 1 turned up in 2011 but proved to unplayable.
The Trial of a Time Lord part 9-12 (aka Terror of the Vervoids) (Malcolm Clarke / BBC Radiophonic Workshop, 1986) - Masters in RWS archive.
The Trial of a Time Lord parts 13-14 (aka The Ultimate Foe) (Dominic Glynn, 1986) - Masters held by Dominic Glynn; copies in the BBC Enterprises Library.
From this point, all music was recorded in stereo:
Time and the Rani (Keff McCulloch, 1987) - Masters held by BBC Worldwide.
Paradise Towers (Keff McCulloch, 1987) - Parts 1 & 2 Masters held by BBC Worldwide. Parts 3 & 4 from MiniDisc copy held by Keff.
Delta and the Bannermen (Keff McCulloch, 1987) - From MiniDisk copy held by Keff. No masters survive.
Dragonfire (Dominic Glynn, 1987) - Masters held by Dominic.
Remembrance of the Daleks (Keff McCulloch, 1988) - From MiniDisk copy held by Keff. No masters survive.
The Happiness Patrol (Dominic Glynn, 1988) - Masters held by Dominic.
Silver Nemesis (Keff McCulloch, 1988) - Masters held by BBC Worldwide.
The Greatest Show in the Galaxy (Mark Ayres, 1988) - Masters held by composer.
Battlefield (Keff McCulloch, 1989) - Masters held by BBC Worldwide.
Ghost Light (Mark Ayres, 1988) - Masters held by composer.
The Curse of Fenric (Mark Ayres, 1989) - Masters held by composer.
Survival (Dominic Glynn, 1989) - Masters held by Dominic.
One other oddity is a reel of music entitled "Doctor Who Library", by Dudley Simpson. It consists of a number of short cues written for BBC Enterprises as "fillers" for foreign sales of the programme, based on elements of Dudley's original scores.
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