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Post by William Martin on Dec 17, 2004 15:47:43 GMT
"Supposing Dr Who was all there and every episode was crisp, clean and accounted for and had been repeated several times. would it still have such an obsessive following?" The answer is probably yes! Star Trek has all it's episodes extant and available for all, yet that has a core audience of fans so obssessed (dictionaries in klingon and Klingon weddings? ?!!!!!) that they make Who fans look mild by comparision. I think so yes, if anything the missing epispodes mean that the obsession is less because there are fewer programs to be obsessive about, but it does mean there is more discussion/argument about hidden/lost meaning ala prisoner.
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Post by Lance on Dec 17, 2004 19:32:05 GMT
good points! forgot all about star trec and the prisoner. I suppose there is an allegory of the bbc in the celestial toy maker somewhere?
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Post by Rob Moss on Dec 18, 2004 21:08:03 GMT
good points! forgot all about star trec and the prisoner. I suppose there is an allegory of the bbc in the celestial toy maker somewhere? Veering even further off topic, and I raise this onyl because I just can't even begin to work it out - I can understand what Dr Who fans talk about, and I can understand what Star Trek fans talk about, as they have hundreds of episodes to digest... But there were only 17 episodes of The Prisoner, FFS..! What can there be left to say after nearly 40 years..??
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Post by Gareth R on Dec 19, 2004 9:02:43 GMT
But there were only 17 episodes of The Prisoner, FFS..! What can there be left to say after nearly 40 years..?? I think the answer is probably that The Prisoner benefits from only being 17 episodes long! It didn't have time to become repetitive and to recycle itself, as both DW and ST constantly did, so it never had a chance to become stale. Additionally, whereas there's virtually nothing from DW or ST that hasn't been explained down to the last detail by the writers, directors and so on, there's still an aura of mystery around aspects of The Prisoner. McGoohan has deliberately shied away from offering pat explanations (geddit?) for many things, so there's still a huge amount of room for debate and personal interpretation. I honestly believe that The Prisoner represents a higher form of televisual life than either DW or ST - there's so much more packed into the writing, performances and direction, it was never about simplistic goodies-versus-baddies, and you couldn't count on everything being made all right in the last two minutes of the story.
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Post by William Martin on Dec 21, 2004 16:25:35 GMT
the prisoner is one of the very few genuinely surreal TV shows, others would be Gurney Slade, twin peaks, Lexx and Kingdom Hospital among a very few others, many of the writers have admitted that hat they didn't understand it either, even when they were writing it, so we haven’t got a hope of ever explaining it. Add to this the rules that MCgoohan insisted on ie no number 7(was it?) on the taxi board, and the continualy changing number 2s and other stuff that is realy personal and private to him.And your right, the writing and production was of a very high standard but Dr who doesn't realy have any of that,(writing and acting was variable and the sets often cheap) except where a missing episode allows for interpretation.
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Post by Lance on Dec 21, 2004 16:55:06 GMT
as of course the science behind a dr who,usally lets peoples in or out, but not in the main context of being who ever they were, or if the script called for it, or indeed part of the main shenagans.
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Post by William Martin on Dec 21, 2004 16:59:57 GMT
yes , dr who has its moments, and for what it is it's very good but I supose after a while you run out of ideas from time to time, the Prisoner only had 17 episodes. still we'll have to see about "Who" in the new year
and of course Dr Who had its resident science advisors so they had an advantage there.
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Post by Andy OBrien on Dec 21, 2004 19:40:17 GMT
Add to this the rules that MCgoohan insisted on ie no number 7(was it?) on the taxi board, and the continualy changing number 2s and other stuff that is realy personal and private to him. The constantly changing 2s was George Markstein's idea. I'm not sure about the 7s because McGoohan's own scripts were edited to remove refernences to numbers containing 7. It might have come from McGoohan, but at least at some point he was OK with 7s in the show. Also, all references to religion were removed (and McGoohan's scripts were again among those edited).
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Post by Lance on Dec 22, 2004 14:47:17 GMT
The idea of McGoohan constantly dropping N0.2s probably gave the village more flavour?
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Post by John Miller on Dec 22, 2004 19:36:20 GMT
Sorry to come in this thread again! (O/T too). All I wanted to add was the stories relating to 'The Prisoner's general summarised storyline. I was always fascinated by two versions I heard. One, that McGoohan; though reluctant to cut & dry its meaning, saying it spoke for itself; had intended the piece as an allegory on westernised man being a prisoner of modern society. The other more interesting theory: that the show was a manifestation of his frustration & repression resulting from his catholic upbringing. Something to chew over anyway! Yes, this is nothing to do with the header topic...
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