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Post by Tony Walshaw on Aug 31, 2014 8:22:27 GMT
Canned Heat could probably not perform their song on TOTP for musicians union reasons?
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Post by Ray Langstone (was saintsray) on Sept 1, 2014 9:42:26 GMT
Canned Heat could probably not perform their song on TOTP for musicians union reasons? I think that is the most likely reason. However it could just have been that the TOTP film was made in advance, and they happened to be in the UK anyway, but that I feel is a long shot. All sorts of union rulings in the 70's and bureaucracy caused problems in the TV industry. Please note, I am NOT being anti-union. My old man was a shop steward! (#not in the TV industry or entertainment!!!!)
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Post by Tony Walshaw on Sept 4, 2014 7:02:38 GMT
As previously touched upon in other threads, TOTP was subject to MU restrictions.
One consequence is that when non-UK acts appeared in the studio, they tended to perform a live vocal over a live TOTP Orchestra backing.
This is evident in the re-runs of 1976 onwards, with e.g. Thelma Houston, Baccara, Yvonne Elliman being examples.
An act from e.g. the USA coming onto a UK show and miming probably represented no work at all for the musicians of the host country. Possibly the MU were particularly averse to this, as opposed to a UK new wave act (The Jam, The Buzzcocks) effectively miming to their original recording.
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Post by Ray Langstone (was saintsray) on Sept 4, 2014 9:31:01 GMT
As previously touched upon in other threads, TOTP was subject to MU restrictions. One consequence is that when non-UK acts appeared in the studio, they tended to perform a live vocal over a live TOTP Orchestra backing. This is evident in the re-runs of 1976 onwards, with e.g. Thelma Houston, Baccara, Yvonne Elliman being examples. An act from e.g. the USA coming onto a UK show and miming probably represented no work at all for the musicians of the host country. Possibly the MU were particularly averse to this, as opposed to a UK new wave act (The Jam, The Buzzcocks) effectively miming to their original recording. There is a massive variance, but for the later 70's TOTP, the case seems to have been that generally the non-UK acts did this.
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Post by John Green on Sept 4, 2014 9:45:17 GMT
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Post by Ray Langstone (was saintsray) on Sept 4, 2014 10:56:02 GMT
The TOTP Orchestra version of the Hustle is quite interesting. The vocalists only contributed a small number of their lines, because the mics did not seem to have been turned up for them during the first half of the song!
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Post by markdixon on Sept 6, 2014 16:21:13 GMT
I’ve got a few more observations and pieces of information that might help place ‘Octopus’ into some kind of context. It strikes me that ‘Octopus’ was a strange programme to put on in a teatime slot. It concerned ideas, arts and music and was co-presented by an editor of the underground magazine ‘OZ’. It sometimes featured controversial and unusual guests and it included the sort of bands that were more often heard on John Peel’s radio programmes. It occurred to me this week that there was an earlier teatime programme that contained those same ingredients. ‘How It Is’ was broadcast on BBC1 in 1968 and it included ‘OZ’ editor Richard Neville as one of the co-presenters. Neville returned for its sequel ‘How Late It Is’ in 1969. Perhaps Granada producers watched these BBC programmes and decided to make something similar.
We’ll never be able to compare ‘How It Is’ and ‘Octopus’ due to lack of archive material, but I suspect that the BBC programme was livelier. It included a studio audience and regular appearances by the light-entertainment folk group the Spinners. A regular theme of ‘Octopus’ was the connection between the arts and technology. Available evidence suggests that ‘How It Is’ and ‘How Late It Is’ didn’t cover technology in great detail.
As far as I know Andrew Fisher didn’t present any programmes apart from ‘Octopus’. The listings in the ‘TV Times’ indicate that he was replaced by Chris Kelly as the main presenter of the programme towards the end of its run. Kelly was an experienced Granada presenter so perhaps ‘Octopus’ became a more conventional programme when he took over. Did the later episodes feature bands?
Fisher was also a BBC script writer, probably during the late 1960s, but I haven’t been able to find out which programmes he worked on. I did discover that he acted in and directed a 15 minute avant-garde comedy film called ‘X Requests’ in 1974. It might be of interest to readers of this forum because it features a cameo appearance by John Peel. The film is so obscure that it doesn’t even feature on the John Peel Wiki site. It still exists and a synopsis is available on the Lux artists’ moving image website.
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Post by robchapman on Sept 6, 2014 17:50:39 GMT
very interesting observations Mark. It strikes me that ‘Octopus’ was a strange programme to put on in a teatime slot.......It occurred to me this week that there was an earlier teatime programme that contained those same ingredients. ‘How It Is’ was broadcast on BBC1 in 1968 and it included ‘OZ’ editor Richard Neville as one of the co-presenters. Neville returned for its sequel ‘How Late It Is’ in 1969. Perhaps Granada producers watched these BBC programmes and decided to make something similar.
Fisher was also a BBC script writer, probably during the late 1960s, but I haven’t been able to find out which programmes he worked on. I did discover that he acted in and directed a 15 minute avant-garde comedy film called ‘X Requests’ in 1974. It might be of interest to readers of this forum because it features a cameo appearance by John Peel. The film is so obscure that it doesn’t even feature on the John Peel Wiki site.
Re first point. Not that strange when you look at it in context. Stranger than the future monty pythons and the bonzos on Do Not Adjust Your Set? The Owl Service? Freddie Garrity in Oliver In The Overworld? Or Nice Time, which featured Kenny Everett, Germaine Greer, and Viv Stanshall. All teatime kiddie slot programmes. Those were different times my friend. Less niche marketing. I'm not normally one to join in when people start banging on about music being better in the old days - we all turn into our parents eventually, but in the case of childrens tv, even if it wasn't necessarily better it was certainly stranger. Re last point. Gosh. "Wiki not comprehensive" shocker.
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Post by markdixon on Sept 6, 2014 18:39:25 GMT
Thanks Rob. Another strange teatime programme from that era to add to your list is the series of performances by the Liverpool Scene which Granada broadcast in 1969. Some of the songs must have been unsettling to many viewers, especially 'We'll All Be Spacemen Before We Die'.
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Post by Tony Walshaw on Sept 7, 2014 10:02:40 GMT
I think those in charge of broadcasting became uneasy around 1970.
As far as presenting was concerned, this included the shenanigans of Dee and Everett.
The deaths of certain prominent rock stars, and other misfortunes like the Manson murders and Altamount, made events like the UK free festivals seem subversive and dangerous to older generations.
Avant garde guest artists on prime-time family shows were phased out onto niche shows once more.
On Radio 1, the general broadcasters like Edmonds and Hamilton were preferred on weekday daytimes. No more 'Mid-day Spins' with Rosko. Even Fluff's fast-flowing and lively 'Pick of the Pops' was replaced by a toned-down show by the actor Tom Browne.
The establishment re-gained control.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2014 10:16:58 GMT
Yes, things were definitely more experimental generally in the late '60s and this filtered right through to children's TV shows too. Series like DNAYS, Owl Service, Little Big Time etc. (mentioned above) and numerous others such as Ed & Zed and Zokko! illustrate this well. By the start of the '70s, elements of psychedelia were coming into the mainstream and that's why the early part of that decade (more so than the mid-late '60s, when it was first occurring) looks like a multi-coloured drug-induced extravaganza to modern eyes!
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Post by robchapman on Sept 7, 2014 16:44:55 GMT
Thanks Rob. Another strange teatime programme from that era to add to your list is the series of performances by the Liverpool Scene which Granada broadcast in 1969. Some of the songs must have been unsettling to many viewers, especially 'We'll All Be Spacemen Before We Die'. Funny you should mention that particular song and that particular programme. I saw Liverpool Scene a few times between 1970 and whenever it was they morphed into Grimms. They even played my local Tech college in Bedford. No gig too small. They were that kind of band. But I hadn't listened to them or even thought about them in more than 30 years, so as you do I You Tubed them just to see if they were as good as I remember them - and I came across a clip of that actual tv performance. What a stonker! And just as good as I remember them. quote author="@laurencepiper" source="/post/123842/thread" timestamp="1410085018"]Yes, things were definitely more experimental generally in the late '60s and this filtered right through to children's TV shows too. Series like DNAYS, Owl Service, Little Big Time etc. (mentioned above) and numerous others such as Ed & Zed and Zokko! illustrate this well. By the start of the '70s, elements of psychedelia were coming into the mainstream and that's why the early part of that decade (more so than the mid-late '60s, when it was first occurring) looks like a multi-coloured drug-induced extravaganza to modern eyes! [/quote] Quite agree Laurence. I suppose it begins really with Delia Derbyshire in 1963 and the Dr Who theme and filters all the way through to the early 70s when the most futuristic space age sounds being heard were on maths programmes for schools at 10.30 in the morning and local radio jingles and station idents.
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Post by John Green on Sept 7, 2014 17:45:02 GMT
Yep.I saw Grimms a couple of times,too.There was one sketch which involved inviting a lass from the audience to take part,and ended with her breast getting squeezed.Heaven knows what the PC brigade would make of it.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 7, 2014 19:15:37 GMT
Thanks Rob. Another strange teatime programme from that era to add to your list is the series of performances by the Liverpool Scene which Granada broadcast in 1969. Some of the songs must have been unsettling to many viewers, especially 'We'll All Be Spacemen Before We Die'. Funny you should mention that particular song and that particular programme. I saw Liverpool Scene a few times between 1970 and whenever it was they morphed into Grimms. They even played my local Tech college in Bedford. No gig too small. They were that kind of band. But I hadn't listened to them or even thought about them in more than 30 years, so as you do I You Tubed them just to see if they were as good as I remember them - and I came across a clip of that actual tv performance. What a stonker! And just as good as I remember them. No one has mentioned what the show was actually called. As the clip you remembered turned up on Youtube though, am I right in assuming the series still exists? Looks to be a forgotten gem if so!
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Post by John Green on Sept 7, 2014 20:04:27 GMT
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