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Post by ethantyler on Jun 13, 2005 1:47:37 GMT
I was just reading through this (<--- clickable) thread and I was wondering, have letter-writing strategies ever proved successful for any missing series, not just Doctor Who? I'm just thinking how I'd like to see more Doomwatch, particularly Survival Code... There are many other classic series that are lost that might benefit from as much missing episode hunting enthusiasm as Doctor Who enjoys. I know there are people looking for series other than Doctor Who, but there's certainly not nearly as many. Do you think more effort put into searching for Doomwatch, A for Andromeda, Out of the Unknown, Z Cars, Adam Adamant Lives! and so on could lead to more episodes being found? |
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Post by Frederick Thompson on Jun 13, 2005 21:01:26 GMT
It would be great to recover any 1960s drama programmes and letter writing to archives might help. However letters cost money and it might be more use finding generic e-mail addresses in foreign TV companies and asking the recipient departments to forward internally to likely personnel and retirees. That way you might reach promoted staff and knowledgeable retirees.
Seeing as A for Andromeda was mentioned I know of at least one web site for it in French so could anyone say if it were ever sold to France? I am sure plenty of French people would have appreciated Julie Christie, even with subtitles
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Post by ethantyler on Jun 14, 2005 2:19:25 GMT
It would be great to recover any 1960s drama programmes and letter writing to archives might help. However letters cost money and it might be more use finding generic e-mail addresses in foreign TV companies and asking the recipient departments to forward internally to likely personnel and retirees. That way you might reach promoted staff and knowledgeable retirees. I don't usually approve of pestering overseas archives, but there appears to be no official effort into finding the majority of missing material, so I can't see any real harm in trying. I wonder how much priceless material has been destroyed by overseas archives in the past few decades? That's interesting, although, typically, if the episodes were recovered from France, you just know they'd be dubbed! Would it be possible to obtain details of overseas sales for non-Doctor Who series? |
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Post by Gareth R on Jun 14, 2005 17:47:05 GMT
Many people do seem to have a rather simplistic idea of what's involved in searching archives to see if any missing material is available.
To start with, you need accurate records of what was sold to any given broadcaster. Then you've got to find somebody in that broadcaster's archive who is willing to take time to go through those records and cross-reference them with what they actually hold... that's assuming that their holdings are fully catalogued in an easily-accessible way, of course, and that catalogue includes anything that should have been destroyed or sent back 30 years ago. And since archives are usually considered commercially sensitive, you'd probably need permission from senior management at the broadcaster as well.
Bottom line - it's actually a complicated, specialised and time-consuming business and, even if the broadcaster is willing to co-operate, usually requires a lot of delicate negotiation in the relevant native language by people who know what they're doing.
Speculative letters or emails written in English (or translated via Babelfish) by random British anoraks are almost certain to end up in the bin.
However, since some people are bound to complain that the truth is defeatist, a useful starting point would be to make contact with reputable film researchers in the relevant countries. They are the people most likely to have pre-existing relationships, credibility and access to and with the broadcast archives concerned. They'll also speak the local language (no small consideration).
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Post by ethantyler on Jun 14, 2005 19:03:51 GMT
Many people do seem to have a rather simplistic idea of what's involved in searching archives to see if any missing material is available. I already understand what you said perfectly, but my original post was just a starting point enquiring whether such strategies have ever proved successful. I was basically just fantasising about "What if...?". I just wonder if, on the occasions when Doctor Who fans have received replies from oversears archives, whether something else could have been turned up that wasn't enquired about. Although, yes, I understand it's not so straight-forward (and that you can't exactly send a huge list of all the missing episodes). If only more archives catalogued their archives online using databases, eh...? |
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Post by Gareth R on Jun 15, 2005 8:11:09 GMT
If only more archives catalogued their archives online using databases, eh...? But even that's not necessarily a panacea. It's quite possible that any archives that do happen to have retained missing stuff, possibly by accident (i.e. they intended to destroy it or send it back but, for whatever reason, didn't) *don't* have it catalogued - because as far as they're concerned, it was destroyed or sent back! It's my belief that there's a fair bit of missing stuff sitting in uncatalogued, unlabelled cans, and those cans may well be have been forgotten about under piles of other stuff at the back of storage rooms and other places rather than sitting on shelves in proper programme archives. About 3-4 years ago, a number of 405-line quad tapes were found under the flooring of LWT's VT area during a rewiring project. Nobody knows who put them there or why, and I think they turned out to be sports programming (so missing episode anoraks immediately lost interest), but it points to further possibilities for finding material at longstanding broadcasters. Of course, what it needs is a proper top-to-bottom search of the buildings concerned, which is never, ever going to happen, so the best we can hope is that things get found in dusty corners during renovations or refurbishments. |
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Post by CliveUK123 on Jun 15, 2005 12:11:47 GMT
[quote author=Gareth R board=general thread=1118627257 post=1118823069
About 3-4 years ago, a number of 405-line quad tapes were found under the flooring of LWT's VT area during a rewiring project. Nobody knows who put them there or why, and I think they turned out to be sports programming (so missing episode anoraks immediately lost interest), but it points to further possibilities for finding material at longstanding broadcasters.
[/quote]
If its anything like where I used to work, raised flooring was an ideal temporary storage area ! Also a good 'out of sight, out of mind' place to hide items which I just couldn't bear to part with. Of course I soon forgot just which floor tile I had put a particular item under and I suspect there is still a lot of my hidden items there today (together with lost screwdrivers, meters and krone tools etc)
So I have no doubt that there could well be more tapes hidden under the floors of TV companies etc.....
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Post by andrew martin on Jun 15, 2005 12:48:54 GMT
Before anyone asks, the BBC archive has solid concrete floors...
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Post by Mark T on Jun 15, 2005 13:00:21 GMT
Actually if memory serves (and I was involved in film research at the time at LWT) under the floors were found some engineering test tapes, one of which was a "Kenny Everett Video Explosion" and another contained the opening 90 secs of a colour "Simon Dee", the only remaining footage form his LWT days.
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Post by pete on Jun 15, 2005 13:48:51 GMT
under floorboards are great place of lost nostalgia we had a flood when the washing machine broke, and the kitchen floor had to be ripped up, and what should we find  a September 1963 Radio times, letters and a few newspapers (a possible time vault) which was replaced with a new one !!! A music CD, a letter, coins and a newspaper. all sealed under the new floor. when the hallway was re-carpeted we found newspapers from 1971 (news of the world and the sun) |
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Post by Simon Winchester on Jun 18, 2005 0:14:38 GMT
Apart from the obvious examples of too much being under the floorboards (e.g. 10, Rillington Place), has anyone else found films underneath there scuttling or skirting boards.
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Post by PHNEILL on Jun 18, 2005 14:16:30 GMT
Simon Dee tape was presumably from his colour LWT series in 1970.
Anyone know what were the 405 line video tapes found at LWT?
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Post by ethantyler on Jun 18, 2005 19:38:38 GMT
About 3-4 years ago, a number of 405-line quad tapes were found under the flooring of LWT's VT area during a rewiring project. Nobody knows who put them there or why, and I think they turned out to be sports programming (so missing episode anoraks immediately lost interest), but it points to further possibilities for finding material at longstanding broadcasters. Fascinating! They really do turn up everywhere unimaginable, don't they? |
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Post by Simon Winchester on Jun 19, 2005 9:36:40 GMT
It may be possible that someone is unknowingly using 405 line tapes in a modern art sculpture for example. They may have had other uses such as garden ornaments etc
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Post by steve davies on Jun 21, 2005 13:46:17 GMT
From Gareth R's post To start with, you need accurate records of what was sold to any given broadcaster. Then you've got to find somebody in that broadcaster's archive who is willing to take time to go through those records and cross-reference them with what they actually hold... that's assuming that their holdings are fully catalogued in an easily-accessible way, of course, and that catalogue includes anything that should have been destroyed or sent back 30 years ago. And since archives are usually considered commercially sensitive, you'd probably need permission from senior management at the broadcaster as well." Sometimes you dont even get that, I have taken part in Bill Spilby's archive contacting quest, and I asked Richard Bignell for some advice on non Doctor Who shows to ask about. As Richard points out on another thread, sometimes the overseas sales info in not accessable.  So I have asked for an educated guess. Fingers crossed !!! Just for the record I have contacted Carebbean stations adding Z Cars and Doomwatch to the list for the educated guess.  Along with Out of the Unknown and A For Andromeda for my own personal back slaps ): ;D Steve |
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