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Post by Richard Bignell on Feb 25, 2012 13:25:30 GMT
It's still rather odd that the label should have been on a 35mm can though.
If you look back in on this thread, David, did Enterprises ever have a habit of putting 16mm prints in 35mm cans at all, or is this a bit of a one-off in your experience?
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Post by Jon Preddle on Feb 26, 2012 8:05:46 GMT
(I still have all the labels for the Ice Warriors and Fury cans), but not what may or may not have been in it, as it was empty when I got to check it! - If you check elsewhere on this site, my Fury label is there. Davidx Hi David Any chance of you putting the labels up on the site here? I'd be interested to see if there's any markings on them that might shed some light on their point of origin or movements. The Fury label I have seen elsewhere has 16/35 mm printed on the bottom, with 35 crossed out. There is also a hand-written notation of 2 of 2 reels, and also 16B, and also A/B with the B colored in red. I also says "join in both reels". From these markings, it does indeed appear that at some point in time, that particular print of the episode was split into two sorter rolls. |
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Post by Brad Phipps on Feb 26, 2012 8:36:05 GMT
From these markings, it does indeed appear that at some point in time, that particular print of the episode was split into two sorter rolls. What would the point of that be? They would only be ~12 minutes long each. There's no indication/documentation to say this episode... at some point in history... might possibly... have existed as 35mm...?  |
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Post by Richard Bignell on Feb 26, 2012 9:12:30 GMT
There's no indication/documentation to say this episode... at some point in history... might possibly... have existed as 35mm...? No, recorded to VT and the location work was one on 16mm. However, if it was split into two reels as the label indicates, then it makes sense that it was in a 35mm can. |
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Post by Jon Preddle on Feb 26, 2012 19:22:31 GMT
From these markings, it does indeed appear that at some point in time, that particular print of the episode was split into two sorter rolls. What would the point of that be? They would only be ~12 minutes long each. Maybe the film had been cut at that point by a broadcaster to enable ad breaks to be inserted, and rather than splice the film together afterwards, the broadcaster left the film as is for the benefit of the subsequent broadcaster who now had a pre-determined ad break insert point to be used if so required. |
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Post by Jon Preddle on Feb 26, 2012 20:24:13 GMT
Also of note is, the label says TELERECORDING CUTTING COPY.
What exactly is a Cutting Copy? Is that for BBC internal purposes only? Maybe this particular print wasn't sent / returned from overseas at all.
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Post by Richard Bignell on Feb 26, 2012 20:24:59 GMT
I have asked Andrew Martin about all of this...
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Post by LanceM on Feb 26, 2012 21:46:18 GMT
Very interested to hear the end on that one Richard. I have thought this myself after seeing the same can here in question.
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Post by Brad Phipps on Feb 26, 2012 22:04:29 GMT
Also of note is, the label says TELERECORDING CUTTING COPY. Did you find the label? Can you share it here? |
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Post by Richard Bignell on Feb 26, 2012 22:07:18 GMT
It's in Nothing at the End of the Lane #2, Brad.
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Post by Brad Phipps on Feb 26, 2012 22:17:11 GMT
It's in Nothing at the End of the Lane #2, Brad. Next you'll be telling me that issue has a Tele-Snap article in it. I'll get me coat. |
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Post by davidstead on Feb 26, 2012 22:28:36 GMT
I will try and put the labels up on here soon - The scan of the Fury label on this site isn't my scan, I lent the labels to Paul Vanezis many moons back. I got the labels back, but even I don't have copies of the scans. Once I get the originals scanned I'll pop them on here.
Cutting copies are generally what they say they are, in that they are used for editing purposes for some reason. Enterprises may have had a different meaning for cutting copy, but I don't think they did.
There's a possibility the Fury can did have something who orientated in it, but by the time I got to see it, the day after the cans returned from Villiers House basement, it was most certainly empty! The reason I say a possibility, is that whist working in Accessions dept in 1985 (notably both Sue Malden's and Adam Lee's previous depts before Archives), an enterprises promo for the opening night of BBC2, arrived and then promptly vanished. I think a query was raised as to what's it's actual home should be (plus one of the film examination dept chappies appeared showing quite a big interest it)...it then was never seen again......so if that could disappear without trace, anything's possible! I unfortunately suffered my Brain Haemmorhage in October roughly a month after The Ice Warriors return, so was not back until March 1988.
The most likely answer i would say from experience, is that the can was reused and something else was in the can by the time it returned and in any case, 25 years after the event, I doubt we'll ever know what!
Hope that helps,
Davidx
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Post by Jon Preddle on Mar 4, 2012 21:39:02 GMT
hey there guys, don't mean to beat a half dead horse to death here, but i researched the Canadian Space Network history on wikipedia; it doesn't list Doctor Who as a re-run program, however, I know that it was, also, the episodes of Unearthly Child ran at the inception of the station; October 18- 21 1997 Paul or Richard, I would be willing to assist with the tracking of these facts personally, if need be A (hopefully!) full history of DW on Space is covered on the BroaDWcast site, here: gallifreybase.com/w/index.php/Space |
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Post by davidstead on Mar 5, 2012 14:42:06 GMT
Hi Senkowski,
In answer to your question about the Adam Adamant lives episodes, they would have most likely been junked along with most other programme f/r when no longer available to enterprises to sell.
It is true the Adam adamant final episode 'A sinister sort of service', was in a can labelled as something completely different, but as far as the 'Fury' material, I've explained earlier, that I was undfortunately on a days leave on the day they were sent from villiers to the film library at windmill road, so can't attest to what was in each can that arrived. everything that was labelled had what was in the relative cans, EXCEPT adam adamant and Fury. It's a good thing I kept the labels from the Ice Warriors and fury, at least it confirms there was something, but only two people are likely to have ever known. Vince Howley (reviews clerk at the time in the archives dept) and of course Adam Lee! We know what Mr Lee was/is like regarding archival material as he deliberately marked the ice warriors master prints with cue dots. I doubt Vince Howley remembers, I don't recall him being a Dr Who fan.
Hope that helps.
Davidx
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Post by willcosens on Mar 8, 2012 17:57:01 GMT
If it hasn't been done maybe we could contact him (Vince Howley) at some point???
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