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Post by Jaspal Cheema on Apr 5, 2020 15:21:39 GMT
This is interesting but there have been plenty of hoaxes. The important question is has PM seen unambiguous evidence? Something like a still that doesn’t match an existing telesnap, for example. Only if he wants to give the Restoration Team heart attacks. My understanding is that the films are left undisturbed to try and prevent any damage. The film cans will be examined, but that's as far as they'll go until the films are "returned". Obviously doesn't confirm anything, could still be a fake or even a real film can with mismatching contents but it's better to take their word for it and be disappointed down the line than risk an actual find in case it's a hoax. Does that mean Scott that the films have already been handed over from the private collectors?I thought PM only said that he 'knew of 6 episodes HELD by private collectors'?
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Post by scotttelfer on Apr 5, 2020 15:40:32 GMT
Only if he wants to give the Restoration Team heart attacks. My understanding is that the films are left undisturbed to try and prevent any damage. The film cans will be examined, but that's as far as they'll go until the films are "returned". Obviously doesn't confirm anything, could still be a fake or even a real film can with mismatching contents but it's better to take their word for it and be disappointed down the line than risk an actual find in case it's a hoax. Does that mean Scott that the films have already been handed over from the private collectors?I thought PM only said that he 'knew of 6 episodes HELD by private collectors'? Just that the films won't be checked in situ. If they had been handed over he wouldn't have had any need to make this announcement.
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Post by John Wall on Apr 5, 2020 18:48:42 GMT
This is interesting but there have been plenty of hoaxes. The important question is has PM seen unambiguous evidence? Something like a still that doesn’t match an existing telesnap, for example. Only if he wants to give the Restoration Team heart attacks. My understanding is that the films are left undisturbed to try and prevent any damage. The film cans will be examined, but that's as far as they'll go until the films are "returned". Obviously doesn't confirm anything, could still be a fake or even a real film can with mismatching contents but it's better to take their word for it and be disappointed down the line than risk an actual find in case it's a hoax. If a collector - who presumably watches films in their collection - has them it’s not unreasonable to expect something better than a can recovered from decades on a shelf in Nigeria! I’m interested in knowing how PM can be sure that the prints are DW MEs? Has he seen them?
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Post by George D on Apr 5, 2020 20:12:43 GMT
based on most of pm's comments perhaps he falls more into the optimistic column rather than the pessimist column.
Also, many like being in the spotlight.
Hopefully something shows up, but with "wind blowing" comments years ago where everyone wagged their tails, nothing has still materialized.
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Post by lousingh on Apr 5, 2020 23:25:38 GMT
IMHO, PM is very circumspect because he knows the frenzy that would the merest hint like this. Thus, I think he is quite certain of the material and has an idea of the shape it is in.
I hold out hope that anything that a typical collector holds is in at least decent condition. If you have prize possessions, you go out of your way not to let them deteriorate.
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Post by scotttelfer on Apr 5, 2020 23:28:02 GMT
based on most of pm's comments perhaps he falls more into the optimistic column rather than the pessimist column. Also, many like being in the spotlight. Hopefully something shows up, but with "wind blowing" comments years ago where everyone wagged their tails, nothing has still materialized. This sounds more like the total opposite, this is people scared to come forward because there's a ravenous group of fans that want "hoarders" burnt at the stake.
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Post by Jaspal Cheema on Apr 6, 2020 8:22:17 GMT
You could be cynical and say well ALL 97 missing episodes exist in private hands but Phillip Morris says that he knows of 6 episodes that have been retained in this way and that's good enough for me.There are probably many negotiations that he must have had with the owners to even get to this position of being able to announce it!I'm assuming that the collectors are therefore comfortable with his interview,so let's hope they will be released/announced sometime soon.
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Post by stevehoare61 on Apr 6, 2020 10:15:00 GMT
I'm not sure how I feel about this. I think most of us knew there were a few episodes in Private Hands anyway or rather suspected it based on previous items. As a collector myself, albeit vinyl records. I understand the passion of searching it out, swapping or buying it and then adding it to your collection, you may have waited 20 or 30 years to get that disc, but you still shove it into a case and then move on to the next one. Sadly, Collectors don't always worry about the item they have. its part of their treasure and there it stays. Id love to think Phil is able to cajole the Collectors into letting him borrow it and copy it, but then the whole magic of having something no one has, disappears. Im hopefull, but as was mentioned earlier, unfortunately we have been in this 'the wind is blowing in the right direction, itll appear when you least expect it, is somewhere we've all been before, and personally I find it a little cruel, to do this, unless you have a reveal to follow it up with.so Ill believe my eyes when I see it.
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Post by John Wall on Apr 6, 2020 11:17:02 GMT
We must be cautious, there have been too many false hopes over the years - I’m not sure how long I’ve been posting here but there have been plenty in that time. Unfortunately it’s quite easy to cook up a plausible rumour because of the information available, such as broadwcast.org/index.php/Main_PageIf I wanted to create one all I’d have to do is pick MEs from the mid 70s returns from Australia as they’re a known source.
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Post by George D on Apr 6, 2020 14:12:26 GMT
i dont think there is much in the hands of film collectors any more. 50 years have passed and most of the 16mm collectors are getting older/dying off. Im sure it is possible that one or two might still have a couple,but. most of them are getting old.
Assuming they are out there, at least if pm knows about them, when there time is right, he can make a deal.. but who knows...
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Post by Luke Sherlaw on Apr 6, 2020 14:44:08 GMT
Still plenty of collectors in their early 50s and 60s. Whilst it's almost a certainty that one or two MEs have been lost post-junking as a result of the death of the collector, I feel it's almost certain that there are MEs out there still (excluding Web 3 of course).
I don't really get the fear of some of these collectors who think they'll be lynched upon returning material. It's not like they've been named or will be forced to confess to hoarding when they give it back. They can just give it back, make a lot of people happy, and we would be none the wiser.
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Post by John Wall on Apr 6, 2020 17:14:37 GMT
I could contemplate, maybe, up to about half a dozen.
There’s WoF3 plus the couple PV knows about.
It’s certainly possible that another couple were “rescued” from the returns in the 70s.
Thoughts of large “caches” are, unfortunately, unlikely as it’s difficult to come up with a meaningful mechanism by which they could have been assembled.
We owe Ian Levine a lot, if only he’d been just a couple of years earlier.
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Post by John Wall on Apr 6, 2020 18:29:22 GMT
Still plenty of collectors in their early 50s and 60s. Whilst it's almost a certainty that one or two MEs have been lost post-junking as a result of the death of the collector, I feel it's almost certain that there are MEs out there still (excluding Web 3 of course). I don't really get the fear of some of these collectors who think they'll be lynched upon returning material. It's not like they've been named or will be forced to confess to hoarding when they give it back. They can just give it back, make a lot of people happy, and we would be none the wiser. OK, someone in, say, their mid 60s started collecting 16mm prints in their mid 20s - that’s 40 years which means they started in c. 1980. It would be good to have a profile of a “typical” 16mm collector in 2020, what’s their age and when did they start? I have absolutely no idea! Obviously there’s a certain amount of trading which is a way to obtain older prints and there’s also the possibility of “acquiring” prints when their keeper goes to the great projection booth in the sky.
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Post by Jaspal Cheema on Apr 6, 2020 20:09:15 GMT
The strange thing which I don't seem to understand is why the titles of the episodes are not allowed to be mentioned? Is there some algorithm which will somehow allow people to trace the episode back to the collector?The whole scenario seems overly romanticised to me.Wouldn't PM or PV have been told what the title of the episodes are?How do they know they aren't dupes?Can't we be told which ones they are? Just reminds me of ex-girlfriends not telling you what their romantic status is after you've broken up!Probably.
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Post by John Wall on Apr 6, 2020 20:22:49 GMT
The strange thing which I don't seem to understand is why the titles of the episodes are not allowed to be mentioned? Is there some algorithm which will somehow allow people to trace the episode back to the collector?The whole scenario seems overly romanticised to me.Wouldn't PM or PV have been told what the title of the episodes are?How do they know they aren't dupes?Can't we be told which ones they are? Just reminds me of ex-girlfriends not telling you what their romantic status is after you've broken up!Probably. I’ve previously suggested that if the titles are known they wouldn’t be a candidate for animation. Consequently I think it’s pretty certain that episodes of Macra, Faceless, etc, etc aren't known to exist.
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