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Post by paulcooksley on Oct 15, 2018 9:18:17 GMT
I see it's recently come to light that episode 97 of EastEnders (tx January 1986) is officially "missing" - although of course VHS copies do exist.
The reason given is apparently there was a mix up when the episode was transferred from 1" to D3 - the wrong episode was copied over, then incorrectly labelled and the 1" tape junked.
Interesting, although, given the vast size of the BBC archive, I guess, on the odd occasion, these things must happen...
Makes you wonder how many other similar issues like this there are? (Of course, popular series from the eighties are far more likely to have VHS dubs about than anything from the seventies for example)
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Post by garygraham on Oct 15, 2018 14:14:59 GMT
The real tragedy is that thousands of episodes have survived. I have about 280 on VHS. Don't know what I was thinking as can't abide it now  I'm surprised the BBC embraced D3 so enthusiastically. It was launched in 1991. I remember there were concerns about the lifespan of metal particle tapes in 1992. At one point the manufacturers of the domestic formats would only promise a 15 years lifespan. There has been the issue of the D3 format becoming obsolete and I have seen quite a few dropouts on repeats of Top of the Pops. The smaller the tape the bigger the glitch. I wonder how problematic it is behind the scenes? I don't suppose there was much choice for new productions as Betacam uses metal tape too. But shame the BBC didn't just keep the 1 inch tapes of old programmes and transfer to digital file from those. So was there only one 1 inch tape of each programme? Or did they manage to junk two 1 inch tapes of the now missing episode (original and backup)? It shows how migrating from one format to another is always a risk. Paperwork mixed up, tapes mislabeled, technical glitches. Just think of the ones we know of: Lift Off With Ayesha, mobile phone noise on Crossroads... |
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Post by markboulton on Oct 15, 2018 15:07:00 GMT
Mobile phone noise? That intermittent b-buzz-buzz-b-buzz-buzz-b-bzzzzzzzzzz that used to blight hi-fi and TV speakers until manufacturers started putting shielding in for that? I should imagine transfer areas would officially ban the use of mobile communications equipment near VT areas, but we all know how seriously people will take that.
I suspect Betacam SP has held up much better over the years than D2 or D3 has. D2/D3 are digital AND interleaved, which at the time was great, but given tape and head degradation, makes much more of a mess of the picture when the signal is not read optimally. Beta SP on the other hand, being analogue, is more forgiving and less prone to tracking errors.
I'm sure many people on here can attest to a similar experience with DAT vs. Cassette. Hardly any DATs play properly anymore, whereas cassettes that haven't been sat on/thrown out of a car window, will, in the main, still play perfectly. Or as perfectly as they ever did when first recorded.
And let's not get on to Mini DV !
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RWels
Member
Posts: 2,861
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Post by RWels on Oct 15, 2018 15:47:45 GMT
The real tragedy is that thousands of episodes have survived. I have about 280 on VHS. Don't know what I was thinking as can't abide it now Wait wait wait, you were the same person who got very cross about the people of today snubbing yesterdays television programs that are part of the culture and the nation. Yet here I find you looking down on Eastenders.  |
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Post by Ray Langstone (was saintsray) on Oct 15, 2018 17:34:24 GMT
An off-air of the episode has gone back to Kaleidoscope, assuredly.
I organised that bit.
Safety first and all that....
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Post by Simon B Kelly on Oct 15, 2018 19:48:27 GMT
As the series has been repeated on other channels over the years I would expect there are multiple broadcast quality copies of Episode 97 gathering dust somewhere...
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Post by markboulton on Oct 15, 2018 20:41:59 GMT
As the series has been repeated on other channels over the years I would expect there are multiple broadcast quality copies of Episode 97 gathering dust somewhere... Yes, maybe one of those 1997 daytime edits with the scrolling end credits. |
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Post by Richard Marple on Oct 15, 2018 21:37:52 GMT
As the series has been repeated on other channels over the years I would expect there are multiple broadcast quality copies of Episode 97 gathering dust somewhere... I was thinking there would have been duplicates for repeating on UK Gold & such. Do any omnibus editions survive? |
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Post by garygraham on Oct 16, 2018 5:04:37 GMT
As the series has been repeated on other channels over the years I would expect there are multiple broadcast quality copies of Episode 97 gathering dust somewhere... I was thinking there would have been duplicates for repeating on UK Gold & such. Do any omnibus editions survive? Yes that's odd because it would have been repeated as the Sunday Omnibus? The Eastenders 85 repeats were in 1995 which may have been after the D3 accident. |
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Post by garygraham on Oct 16, 2018 5:14:37 GMT
Mobile phone noise? That intermittent b-buzz-buzz-b-buzz-buzz-b-bzzzzzzzzzz that used to blight hi-fi and TV speakers until manufacturers started putting shielding in for that? I should imagine transfer areas would officially ban the use of mobile communications equipment near VT areas, but we all know how seriously people will take that. I suspect Betacam SP has held up much better over the years than D2 or D3 has. D2/D3 are digital AND interleaved, which at the time was great, but given tape and head degradation, makes much more of a mess of the picture when the signal is not read optimally. Beta SP on the other hand, being analogue, is more forgiving and less prone to tracking errors. I'm sure many people on here can attest to a similar experience with DAT vs. Cassette. Hardly any DATs play properly anymore, whereas cassettes that haven't been sat on/thrown out of a car window, will, in the main, still play perfectly. Or as perfectly as they ever did when first recorded. And let's not get on to Mini DV ! Yes apparently some transfers of Crossroads have that mobile blipping noise on? Interesting about the interleaving. MiniDV was one of the worst formats ever. A tape dropout could impact on a couple of frames making it difficult to repair and I found the tapes were only good for maybe five reuses before they had to be binned due to dropouts. I couldn't wait to transfer video off them ASAP after shooting. There was no drag and drop of files then, they had to be played to transfer the video which was laborious especially if you'd filmed a two hour long event with two cameras! Funny how much things have changed. So easy now. |
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Post by paulcooksley on Oct 16, 2018 11:05:41 GMT
I was thinking there would have been duplicates for repeating on UK Gold & such. Do any omnibus editions survive? Yes that's odd because it would have been repeated as the Sunday Omnibus? The Eastenders 85 repeats were in 1995 which may have been after the D3 accident. All I know is that 'Drama' channel is currently repeating the old editions and mentioned in their opening link that they were unable to show this elusive episode "97".
When someone wrote to drama for an answer, they replied that the BBC were "unable" to supply them a copy of this particular edition as it was "missing" from the archives. Someone then digged further re the 1" to D3 transfer.
I thought about the omnibus editions....wonder if they all exist? If so, it would be pretty easy to cobble together the "missing" episode with a couple of edits.
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Post by smccandless on Aug 15, 2019 20:40:26 GMT
Think Drama weren't showing an episode from late Feb/early Mar 1990.
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