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Post by Simon Smith on Oct 12, 2018 4:44:07 GMT
Nobody brought this up?
I watched 'The Woman Who fell to Earth'. And I was thoroughly unimpressed. I never felt that the character was the Doctor at all. The new companions seem "designed by committee", rather than actual characters. The writing was poor, the whole feel of the show never felt like Doctor Who at all.
Sorry to repeat myself, but again, it felt like if a soulless corporate Politically Correct committee decided to do Doctor Who, rather than someone writing a Doctor Who episode. It ticked all the right boxes that a certain kind of person will want ticked, but it lacked anything that makes Doctor Who Doctor Who.
All in all, it wasn't just boring and uninspiring, it was very depressing to see what was once my favourite television show turned into something like this. I hope all the people who were complaining about the Doctor for the past 10 years are happy, though I doubt they can ever truly be happy. I was once very happy watching the Doctor Who I loved, but THAT show is clearly gone forever now, replaced by this ghastly attempt to appease some outspoken people who claim to represent people who they do not.
Two thumbs down.
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Post by Paul McDermott on Oct 12, 2018 7:18:09 GMT
Nobody brought this up? I watched 'The Woman Who fell to Earth'. And I was thoroughly unimpressed. I never felt that the character was the Doctor at all. The new companions seem "designed by committee", rather than actual characters. The writing was poor, the whole feel of the show never felt like Doctor Who at all. Sorry to repeat myself, but again, it felt like if a soulless corporate Politically Correct committee decided to do Doctor Who, rather than someone writing a Doctor Who episode. It ticked all the right boxes that a certain kind of person will want ticked, but it lacked anything that makes Doctor Who Doctor Who. All in all, it wasn't just boring and uninspiring, it was very depressing to see what was once my favourite television show turned into something like this. I hope all the people who were complaining about the Doctor for the past 10 years are happy, though I doubt they can ever truly be happy. I was once very happy watching the Doctor Who I loved, but THAT show is clearly gone forever now, replaced by this ghastly attempt to appease some outspoken people who claim to represent people who they do not. Two thumbs down. When did a new episode of DW pass muster for you, Simon? Last century? Or have you liked the last decade's worth of televised stories? I'm genuinely curious! I think I'd be better able to understand the specifics of your difficulty with this year's opener if you could articulate them a little more clearly, as I've done, in my related thread. That's what some of us do here, right? Discuss our favourite show? I'm sure you'll think I'm off base with my take on The Woman Who Fell To Earth, and that's good. If you're inclined please kick the tyres of how I think things look, or at least tell me what you don't like - and better still, what kind of DW is for you. From the above, it's altogether unclear to me. Is DW a la Moffat a step too far? What's your personal taste in DW, and where does the latest episode fall short of that model? As to relative poverty of writing and questions of committee based character development, representation, etc... well, the ratings are the best they've been in a decade, so clearly Jodie's first episode was well received by other viewers, including fans old and new, whether you consider them such or not. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman
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Post by samnurden on Oct 12, 2018 7:34:38 GMT
Not much to really say as I'm sure everyone has an opinion on this by now. It was okay. Decent in parts, but overhyped so, so much, and this whole "legendary performance," stuff I just don't get. There were a couple of things that didn't work, like the doctor shoving her fingers up her nose. (Bizarre.) And that cocoon thing that Ryan found, looks it was straight out of classic who... Paper mache all 'round. Oh, and Yaz is a bit of a non-entity as far as characters go, too.
Jodie's fine so far though, although nothing striking so far... and Ryan is great, I find. Graham was decent, too. It's like a 6/10? 7, maybe? I don't think it's as incredible as people say, but I don't share the extreme negative approach, either. I'm kind of middling, so far.
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Post by Richard Marple on Oct 12, 2018 11:50:34 GMT
I enjoyed it, though it will probably take an episode or 2 to settle down.
I remember Chris Howarth & Steve Lyons mentioning in the Completely Useless Encyclopedia that all new episodes need 3 - 5 years of dwell time before they can really be appreciated. This was mostly due to the reaction of fans in the 1980s, but is still relevant.
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Post by Simon Smith on Oct 12, 2018 14:00:25 GMT
Nobody brought this up? I watched 'The Woman Who fell to Earth'. And I was thoroughly unimpressed. I never felt that the character was the Doctor at all. The new companions seem "designed by committee", rather than actual characters. The writing was poor, the whole feel of the show never felt like Doctor Who at all. Sorry to repeat myself, but again, it felt like if a soulless corporate Politically Correct committee decided to do Doctor Who, rather than someone writing a Doctor Who episode. It ticked all the right boxes that a certain kind of person will want ticked, but it lacked anything that makes Doctor Who Doctor Who. All in all, it wasn't just boring and uninspiring, it was very depressing to see what was once my favourite television show turned into something like this. I hope all the people who were complaining about the Doctor for the past 10 years are happy, though I doubt they can ever truly be happy. I was once very happy watching the Doctor Who I loved, but THAT show is clearly gone forever now, replaced by this ghastly attempt to appease some outspoken people who claim to represent people who they do not. Two thumbs down. When did a new episode of DW pass muster for you, Simon? Last century? Or have you liked the last decade's worth of televised stories? I'm genuinely curious! Last century? Is that a kneejerk reaction? In fact, the last new episode of Who I liked was in fact with Peter Capaldi as the Doctor. But the ratio of good-to-bad shifted enormously under Moffat. What related thread of yours? And what was not articulated clearly enough for you? And what's with all the smileys? Doctor Who can be many things. In fact, that's part of the reason I dislike the whole Moffat/Chibnall Who. There is no model of what IS Doctor Who, but the Moffat Brigade seem to feel that there is. And TWWFTE is yet another tiresome retread of the Moffat Formula. That's "most watched debut in a decade". But that's pretty much The Moffat Era. They don't touch what Tennant got. What's more, it's not an indicator of what people think at all. That will be how many people remain. [/quote] Is that really your take on my post? Or yet another kneejerk reaction on your part?
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Post by Paul McDermott on Oct 12, 2018 14:57:38 GMT
When did a new episode of DW pass muster for you, Simon? Last century? Or have you liked the last decade's worth of televised stories? I'm genuinely curious! Last century? Is that a kneejerk reaction? In fact, the last new episode of Who I liked was in fact with Peter Capaldi as the Doctor. But the ratio of good-to-bad shifted enormously under Moffat. What related thread of yours? And what was not articulated clearly enough for you? And what's with all the smileys? Doctor Who can be many things. In fact, that's part of the reason I dislike the whole Moffat/Chibnall Who. There is no model of what IS Doctor Who, but the Moffat Brigade seem to feel that there is. And TWWFTE is yet another tiresome retread of the Moffat Formula. That's "most watched debut in a decade". But that's pretty much The Moffat Era. They don't touch what Tennant got. What's more, it's not an indicator of what people think at all. That will be how many people remain. Is that really your take on my post? Or yet another kneejerk reaction on your part? [/quote] Simon, let's get down to cases, eh? And I'm sure we both recall the house rules of civility that our beneficent mods appreciate us observing. Smileys are there to be used, no? I genuinely don't know what you do specifically like, because your opening post in this thread only says that you vaguely but vehemently disapproved of the Series 11 opener. Maybe you don't want me or others to engage with that, which is fine. But if you are keen on a discussion, hence your thread creation, please try to understand my curiosity in doing so. If that's what you consider "knee-jerk", c'est la vie. Consider the following, as you wrote it. And try to understand how much you leave unsaid. And that I haven't jumped (yet) to a conclusion about it, okay? "The character was never the Doctor at all" - Why and how do you derive this position, Simon? "The new companions seem "designed by committee", rather than actual characters." - Ibid. "The writing was poor, the whole feel of the show never felt like Doctor Who at all." - Ibid. I get you didn't like it at all, but I don't know why I should be expected to understand the substance of your remarks when you won't describe in detail what you objected to. If you feel disposed, please compare and contrast, give examples, etc. I confess that reading that you mention liking a Capaldi ep when it's in the Moffat era you say you dislike puzzles me somewhat! Are you more a Davies era fan, things went south as you see it, after Tennant? Or are we talking pre-89? I'll be very surprised if we get a retread of the Moffat run with Chibnall, but I can't see how you can already be so sure that's true on the basis of a single episode. Maybe this too means different things to us. Perhaps you could explain more clearly? You go on further, referencing "soulless corporate Politically Correct committee" and that the show "ticked all the right boxes that a certain kind of person will want ticked, but it lacked anything that makes Doctor Who Doctor Who", which is clear as mud. Looked like the BBC made it to me. Do you think it was outsourced to International Electromatics? Dare I ask whom you refer to as the "certain kind of person"? Could they be (zounds!) casual or new viewers? I don't think the people who liked Jodie's debut are killing the show any more than the fans who loved the Pertwee era did for what came before. Your "ghastly" is their and my "interesting/hopeful/positive", I guess. But I can appreciate that not all changes are as well received by all viewers, regardless of programme or televisual era, something we can perhaps agree on in this instance? For myself, I saw the Doctor turning up, saving humans from a nasty alien, doing DW stuff, ep ends on a cliffhanger. YMMV. Maybe you'll like it next week. But if you don't, watch something you will enjoy more, perhaps? I took a few years off, came back and liked it more. But some versions of the show don't appeal to me. Maybe Jodie's run will be that for you. We're only a tenth of Series 11 in though, so perhaps you'll find things turn around if you give it a chance? Feel free to ignore my post, last thing I'm inclined to do is cause a fuss or ruckus. I merely figured you wanted to discuss things you posted. If not, that's fine! But if you do want to discuss the Jodie era, please have a look at my thoughts on the episode in question in Triskaidekaphobia Of The Daleks. As you'll anticipate, I've reached different conclusions, referencing specific details.
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Post by Dan S on Oct 12, 2018 16:13:17 GMT
New Who was different from Original Who from the very outset, so for anyone to get upset at the latest offering is a bit like closing the stable door after the horse has bolted.
The overall style of production seemed a bit CBeebies, and the theme was good in the way it harked back to the original theme, although the percussion was well naff, sounding like someone bashing away at an old manual typewriter.
Apart from that, it was ok.
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Post by richardwoods on Oct 12, 2018 19:22:53 GMT
Personally with a few exceptions, I haven't consistently enjoyed Dr Who since the Davidson Era and it stopped being a must watch for me during Tom Baker's time. As for Nu Who, I quite enjoyed Eccleston's Dr on some of the episodes but not really since as from Tennant onwards I felt that they were "hamming it up" too much and I stopped watching pretty much altogether apart from the Ice Warriors on a sub one. Yeah I freely admit I'm a dinosaur but I'm quite happy that way. Each to their own
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Post by stevehoare61 on Oct 13, 2018 6:52:24 GMT
I wasnt happy with the choice of Doctor, I can honestly admit that, but I am prepared to give her a chance. It didnt help that there was no theme music, no Tardis and my Partner, who isnt much of a fan but tolerates it, said, I could have walked in on this at any point and not known what I was watching, theres nothing remotely familiar. I enjoyed it for the first half and it was trundling along quite well and then descended into a Predator rip off, which for an opening episode is not a good move. When your making such a radical change as this, and it couldnt be more radical if it tried, you could have at least written something original and pulled out all the stops. Clearly the overnights were very good and thats great but the real test will be in three weeks when the novelty wears off. I am not a PC person and refuse to be brow beaten into this mind and behaviour control by those that are...and Im more than aware that certain things arent as tolerated as they were forty years ago and nothing should be offensive, but I have a bad feeling, the PC brigade may have wrecked this show. No one could ever have accused it lately of being sexist, racist , ageist, it was pretty neutral, and its like meddling for the sake of it. I hope Im wrong.
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RWels
Member
Posts: 2,854
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Post by RWels on Oct 13, 2018 12:29:14 GMT
Don't like the suspenders.
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Post by cjones on Oct 13, 2018 23:11:38 GMT
I thought it was very good, inasmuch as it was tightly plotted, well acted, was at least on nodding terms with exposition (which was shown the door years ago, or at least, that's how it feels), and didn't rely on a succession of one-liners. I found Whittaker's performance to be very assured, and I liked the practical, sanguine attitude. From that perspective, hers felt like a Jon Pertwee type of Doctor. The most surprising revelation for me was Bradley Walsh, who up until last Sunday I couldn't imagine as anything other than a hard-as-nails detective inspector sort, but he settled in very nicely. Yes, the story was derivative, but in all honesty, have you seen the series lately? Or any SF programme, for that matter? If you're going to give it stick for ripping off story X or film Y, form an orderly queue. It's been doing that for *checks notes* about 50 years.
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Post by Paul McDermott on Oct 14, 2018 0:27:26 GMT
Don't like the suspenders. Maybe all the belts in that shop were worse? They're better than the question mark ones we got through the 80s, I think. As to how the clothes will evolve once the Doctor gets her TARDIS back, wait and see I guess. Probably bound to be a bit of variation, like in past eras?
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Post by Paul McDermott on Oct 14, 2018 0:48:46 GMT
I wasnt happy with the choice of Doctor, I can honestly admit that, but I am prepared to give her a chance. It didnt help that there was no theme music, no Tardis and my Partner, who isnt much of a fan but tolerates it, said, I could have walked in on this at any point and not known what I was watching, theres nothing remotely familiar. I enjoyed it for the first half and it was trundling along quite well and then descended into a Predator rip off, which for an opening episode is not a good move. When your making such a radical change as this, and it couldnt be more radical if it tried, you could have at least written something original and pulled out all the stops. Clearly the overnights were very good and thats great but the real test will be in three weeks when the novelty wears off. I am not a PC person and refuse to be brow beaten into this mind and behaviour control by those that are...and Im more than aware that certain things arent as tolerated as they were forty years ago and nothing should be offensive, but I have a bad feeling, the PC brigade may have wrecked this show. No one could ever have accused it lately of being sexist, racist , ageist, it was pretty neutral, and its like meddling for the sake of it. I hope Im wrong. PC brigade? Do you mean the Met? That’s who Probationer Constable Yaz works for! It’s been absolutely ages since Ian and Barbara were told to go and fetch one, and I think she’ll coordinate nicely with the TARDIS exterior, when the Doctor finally gets her Ship back. As the Cricklewood trio sang some 48 years ago, give police a chance! And from your post, it looks like you will, which is all any viewer can be asked to do. I won't be surprised if what some folks see as novelty this year results in both sustained increases in audience and a dwindling but hardened resistance to accept this as a sensible and positive thing for DW. Pretty sure we've been here more than once, right? Regardless, I daresay that DW will fine, unless things go drastically off the rails in ways we've yet to witness since 2005 and that seem to clash with the change between centuries in how the BBC now treats the show.
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Post by andrew shutt on Oct 14, 2018 16:27:48 GMT
Don't like the suspenders. Ooooh doctor who in stockings and suspenders..Sexy time:D (oh Wait you mean braces )
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RWels
Member
Posts: 2,854
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Post by RWels on Oct 14, 2018 17:28:27 GMT
Don't like the suspenders. Ooooh doctor who in stockings and suspenders..Sexy time:D (oh Wait you mean braces ) I will explain later!
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