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Post by johnnyharley on Sept 22, 2014 18:10:33 GMT
I've never been a fan of Androzani myself! I saw it on it's original transmission and apart from the regeneration I found it quite disappointing! I couldn't believe it won story of the year back in 84 or it's subsequent following and I did expect alot more from Robert Holmes considering he'd been away from Who for six years!
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Post by johnnyharley on Sept 22, 2014 18:13:11 GMT
On the other hand I absolutely loved Tomb of The Cybermen and although it's special effects weren't brilliant it was a dream come true! I remembered snippets of it from childhood and was so happy to find it wasn't from Wheel in Space but from one of Pat Troughton's best years!
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Post by shellyharman67 on Sept 22, 2014 19:56:32 GMT
I've never been a fan of Androzani myself! I saw it on it's original transmission and apart from the regeneration I found it quite disappointing! I couldn't believe it won story of the year back in 84 or it's subsequent following and I did expect alot more from Robert Holmes considering he'd been away from Who for six years! I think the acting was OTT for a start. Tomb was ok, but the Cybermen were a bit confined to a small set. Still a classic God knows how Androzani is rated so high. Daemons I thought it was dull and over long .......
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2014 21:12:40 GMT
Well each to their own.
I think The Caves of Androzani is still the best Doctor Who story ever made. The only flaws are the Magna monster and a regeneration tacked on the end. After the superb acting from all the cast it's a shame that Anthony Ainley is hamming it up and Colin Baker appears.
The Caves of Androzani came second to the dreadful Resurrection of the Daleks in the 1984 DWM poll.
I love Tomb as well but isn't most of the acting appalling? The actors playing Kaftan, Kleig, Toberman, Captain Hopper, Victoria, all of Hopper's crew mates, give dismal performances.
Most overrated missing story - The Daleks' Master Plan, particularly episodes 6-11.
Underrated: The Smugglers, The Faceless Ones.
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Post by Paul Vanezis on Sept 22, 2014 23:22:52 GMT
God knows how Androzani is rated so high. Daemons I thought it was dull and over long ....... Season 21 seen back to back over several weeks showed a lot more promise despite the poor start. 'The Awakening' felt good, solid stuff and original despite a reference to an 'old' villain, the Terileptils. Both 'Resurrection' and 'Planet of Fire' had plenty going for them, but it did seem to me that the season was building to something. What 'The Caves of Androzani' lacked in high production values, it more than made up for in script, acting and direction. Even Roger Limb pulled his finger out and provided a stunning score. It was a marvellous end to the season, a highlight and easily up there with the very best DW has to offer. But then we had 'The Twin Dilemma'. Well, ridiculous is all I can say about that. As for 'The Daemons'; well, these things must be seen in the context of the time. I recall watching it with my Dad and loving it. I was quite young, but Jon Pertwee was my Doctor and it was a truly great, unusual story for DW at the time. Other stories were run of the mill, what you expected DW to be, but both 'The Daemons' and 'The Caves of Androzani' exceeded expectations, easily the highlight of their respective seasons. Paul
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Post by Robert Lia on Sept 22, 2014 23:27:59 GMT
I thought that Caves of Androzoni rocked when I saw it on its origional broadcast in 1984. The Daemons which I saw on my local PBS station in 1975 when I was 12 was also very good. I remember seeing the cliffhanger of episode 1 with Bok and I spilled my milk and cookies all over the living room couch cause I jumped so high at the time.
As for The Twin Dilemmas as Peri once said "Yuck" or was that The Doctor to Peri?
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Post by johnforbes on Sept 23, 2014 7:41:51 GMT
Whether any missing story/ep is under-rated or over-rated, I'd rather that it just be in the archive at all, a fact that as each day goes by, seems to get less and less likely.
(Around 18 months now since the RT had anything from PM's search seems to indicate that particular avenue is long dead and buried and that it's time to move on).
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Post by shellyharman67 on Sept 23, 2014 7:47:37 GMT
God knows how Androzani is rated so high. Daemons I thought it was dull and over long ....... Season 21 seen back to back over several weeks showed a lot more promise despite the poor start. 'The Awakening' felt good, solid stuff and original despite a reference to an 'old' villain, the Terileptils. Both 'Resurrection' and 'Planet of Fire' had plenty going for them, but it did seem to me that the season was building to something. What 'The Caves of Androzani' lacked in high production values, it more than made up for in script, acting and direction. Even Roger Limb pulled his finger out and provided a stunning score. It was a marvellous end to the season, a highlight and easily up there with the very best DW has to offer. But then we had 'The Twin Dilemma'. Well, ridiculous is all I can say about that. As for 'The Daemons'; well, these things must be seen in the context of the time. I recall watching it with my Dad and loving it. I was quite young, but Jon Pertwee was my Doctor and it was a truly great, unusual story for DW at the time. Other stories were run of the mill, what you expected DW to be, but both 'The Daemons' and 'The Caves of Androzani' exceeded expectations, easily the highlight of their respective seasons. Paul I kind of liked Terror Of The Autons better. More Dr Who like for me I like you were lucky to see it's first run in the early 70s Resurrection for me was a let down, but Awakening was the Gem in that season for me... I guess it takes all sorts of likes in this crazy world of Dr Who And that is healthy
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Post by richardwoods on Sept 23, 2014 9:00:38 GMT
For what it's worth, I never liked Spearhead, not even first time around. Give me Terror of the Autons anytime. New Doctors first stories always seem a bit dodgy to me, understandably I guess. Robot anyone? Ugh. Will be interesting to see if Power stands up to its revered status if any ever turns up. Unfortunately I can't really remember much at all of watching it first time around. I would be concerned that too much clowning around by Pat finding his way in the role might detract from an otherwise great story.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2014 15:00:16 GMT
Just thought I'd bump this thread up a bit. I can think of a few stories that would hold Holy Grail like status if they were missing. An Unearthly Child The Daleks The Dalek Invasion of Earth The Chase The War Games I am sure that there are others that could be included on this list. I deliberately left out stories like The Tomb of the Cybermen and the Time Meddler as they were previously missing from the achives. I bet "The Keys of Marinus", "The Aztecs", "The Mind Robber" and "The Seeds of Death" would probably hold "Holy Grail" status as well.
Marinus because of all the different sets used Aztecs because of it just being a great story (Like Marco Polo) Mind Robber because everyone would want to now how the Medusa and the Minotaur looked. (Also episode 1 is one of the greatest episodes of Doctor Who ever filmed) And Seeds of Death because if it was completely missing, we would only have about three 60s episodes with the Ice Warriors included. (Ice Warriors 4, 5 & 6)
There Might be some more, but I totally agree about "The Daleks" and "The Dalek Invasion of Earth".
Those suggestions are exellent. I never really thought about those. It just goes to show how you can take those stories that remain in the archives for granted. The stories I chose were very obvious. The very first story. The first Dalek story but I chose the Chase because the Daleks were in it and it was the first story to feature Stephan Taylor and the last story to feature Ian and Barbera. It was also a Dalek story and I think if all of the sixties Dalek stories were missing they would all be holy grail status. I in particular enjoy watching the Chase. I think the last episode of The Dalek Invasion of Earth would also be a particular holy grail because of Susan's departure and the because of the Doctor's speech in the end. Also I chose the War Games due to obvious reasons.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2014 15:09:12 GMT
I think the Caves of Androzani was one of the greatest regeneration stories. It is such a pity that Colin Baker and Sylvester McCoy weren't granted regeneration stories that did their Doctors justice.
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Post by Richard Marple on Sept 23, 2014 16:59:40 GMT
The Awakening is a bit hit & miss, some good ideas such as the Malus feeding on anger, but if feels padded in places for even a 2 parter.
I did wonder what it would have been like as a 4 parts with Kamelion in, as originally planned.
I'll have to dig out the DWM Fact Of Fiction profile.
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Post by johnnyharley on Sept 24, 2014 6:33:33 GMT
Personally I love The Daemons and cannot find fault with any Pertwee serial! Infact the first four Doctors are the best of the bunch! Series 21 was promising much at the time but failed to deliver! Warriors should have been fantastic due to The Silurians and Sea Devils but became a bit of a yawn, Awakening seemed good but there wasn't enough to keep us interested for two episodes let alone four, Frontios I'd say was the best of the series 21, Resurrection too should have been great but failed due to too much violence and an incoherent plot, Fire was good but nothing special except for Peri in her bikini, Androzani was tipped as a magnificent end to Davison's reign but failed to capture my interest at all and the less said about Twin Dilemma the better!
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