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Post by Neil Lambess on Dec 16, 2004 3:37:57 GMT
Hey richard......
i was intrigued by what you said earlier..
"Nope. But then I don't need to have been. it's the usual format for badly made up internet missing-episode rumours. A "friend" happens to have come across a missing episode and the name of the episode reported is 90% correct. Heard it all before!"
Which oddly is exactly how i tracked down THE LION
(although I agree this does sound like a fishy story,and im definatly not trying to shoot you down in flames or anything , I have been to a garage sale here in NZ where a lot of 16mm stuff was for sale and seen film prints that the owner WASNT going to sell , but was still part of his private collection (nothing that was missing though)but over the years ive seen a a considerable amount of ex NZBC stuff in circulation ,some of it in schools, mostly in private hands
Im also NOT entirley convinced that the first two episodes Of MARCO went to Iran ( for one thing they were in English. do you know if the tv channel there transmited in english or in their native toungue?) Secondly Iran is an anomilly in our "Forwarding Circuit" which was mostly Pacific Rim countries, it would have made more sense to send it from somewhere closer.and thirdly only the two episodes went, dont quote me on this but my memory is most serials were forwarded complete.
I was also told by a NZBC/TVNZ employee that some of MARCO was still there around 76/77 and was probably stuck into the legendary (over here at least!) seatoun shipping containers. most of the contents of wich were finally destroyed by the NZ film archive around 94. (Stuff did escape that destruction though ! )
I also know how stuff went walkies from NZBC/TVNZ and this has lead me to belive that the records arent always 100% accurate but say no more!
finally is the person who started this rumour old enough to be on an electoral roll or have a phone listing? hmmm i wonder if i can find a george Talley in our phone books
lets find out!
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Post by Brad Phipps on Dec 16, 2004 9:28:26 GMT
Hi Neil,
I mentioned a couple of these points to Richard on OG and here was his reply:
>>> NZBC, as with all broadcasters, would send the film prints on to whoever BBC Enterprises told them to. Not all countries took the same package of stories, so broadcasters could theoretically be sending prints to many different countries. The BBC didn't do the dubbing. The country concerned would do their own if required, usually to a soundtrack made up of stock music and effects, supplied by the BBC.<<<
So they may have received them, decided it wasn't worth dubbing or acquiring the remaining episodes and stopped the bicycling. Maybe they didn't want edited prints either, which the remaining prints were.
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Post by Jon Preddle on Dec 17, 2004 21:38:04 GMT
There is a very logical reason as to why only eps 1 and 2 of Marco Polo were sent to Iran - these two were not cut by the NZ censor, whereas the other five were edited. It may have been that in 1967 it was BBC policy not to 'bicycle' cut episodes to other countries.
I've checked the Auckland directory for "George Talley" so I think this is yet another wild goose chase...
Jon Preddle
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Post by Graham Howard on Dec 18, 2004 4:05:59 GMT
>I was also told by a NZBC/TVNZ employee that some >of MARCO was still there around 76/77 and was >probably stuck into the legendary (over here at least!) >seatoun shipping containers.
No they couldn't have been Neil, the stuff in the containers was the *exact* stock of films I went through at TVNZ some years previously (from what NZ Film Archive told me), in which I found the film can of MP episode 7, but no episodes! Based on my own experiences, I'm also struggling to see how *any* TVNZ employees would know (or care) that episodes of a particular story of Doctor Who were still around in 76/77. If they said as much, I'd respectfully suggest they were kidding with you.
For what it's worth, I think this whole Eulys Barker story is an obvious lie!! Graham
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Post by Neil Lambess on Dec 18, 2004 22:26:52 GMT
I was told of the existence of serveral doctor who stories in the tvnz arcives around 76-77 by a tvnz employee (who happened to be the best friend of my best friends brother.) i was 13 at the time but it did stick in my memory it was the time here in nz when the target novelisations were big , and knowing that this guy worked at avalon we asked him to check as to why doctor who wasnt on. he would occassionly come up from wellington with a 16mm bell and howell and screen the odd film print to friends! what he told me was that yes, there was stuff there, one about scotsmen, one about marco polo , and to be honest i cant remember what else. but he did accuratly tell me that the stuff was on film prints, and it was the first time i was really aware of what 16mm was through him. post finding the lion , i managed to track him down , after my old best friend lance managed to track me down...(id been trying to find him for years) and he told me confidentially about certain 16mm film collectors who would "obtain" material from NZBC/TVNZ on the "sly". i know how this was done, it explains a lot of anomilies over the years in the records..(although probably not marco as Jon preddles finally solved the mystery) and lets face it with all due respect to "the official facts" no ones going to admit in a public forum or to a complete stranger about a system of theft as a servant. he also told me that there was a film collector in the wairarapa who had obtained quite a bit of science fiction but didnt like any historical who..... this would explain how at a cancelled sports day at harley st school I saw at least two episodes of a troughton story (im sure it was Macra) preceeded by a short film about speed boats and ice sculptures in japan (including a ice thunderbird two) i stuff DID go walkies directly from the building as well as from tip offs of dumpings incidently my old high school had a 16mm avengers episode from the same dumping as the lion.... whats the chances of me locating by chance two items from that dumping? finally although i tend to agree that this Marco ep1 thing is just a rumour. iwe shouldnt just blindly assume that because episode X never screened/was sent on for country X that it cant be a genuine rumour as i know someone in matamata with 16mm film prints of original twilight zone episodes... a show never screened in NZ he brought them in when he moved here in the mid 70s.... with the sheer number of prints made of "roof of the world" how can we declare that nobodys brought one INTO nz in the last 40 years? im checking more than just the auckland phone book on the off chance...
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Post by LanceM on Dec 30, 2004 2:57:55 GMT
Exactly Neil. Just like you said on the Missing Years video "They're out there somewhere". On another note Did you ever manage to contact that collector in wairarapa? If a large article was posted in the Newzealand article about a search for missing Doctor Who, do you think that would be effective in locating a episode or two? With the BBC treasure hunt web link being listed on the article? So since your old school had an episode of the avengers, should Doctor Who fans start contacting the New Zealand School district offices to spread the word, and to search thier collections? Just a thought. Keep up the search! ;D
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Post by eulys barker on Jan 24, 2005 8:09:37 GMT
Hi again, Sorry I didn't answer sooner, but I wanted to clarify the story that I had heard from my friend in New Zealand. Apparently he does have the canister for "The Roof Of The World," but sadly that is all. The film contents were of episode of a very common show titled "rawhide."
Thanks Eulys
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Post by ethantyler on Jan 24, 2005 12:30:34 GMT
Thanks for the update. I don't actually believe you personally, but it's not unreasonable to be distrusting when it comes to missing episode rumours, but the update is appreciated as it puts an end to this particular rumour.
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Post by Stephen Neve on Jan 28, 2005 11:34:03 GMT
"Hey out there!
Has anyone heard back about that rumored episode one of Marco Polo yet? Any Moderators hear anything? Is anything going on lately? Oh, on a thread that I read a while ago someone was talking about a guy in Australia who might have the complete episodes of The Space Pirates and full color of Mind Of Evil, any new news on this topic?"
Well if the story is true, thats a big if then I thinkI know who the guy who may have the space pirates is, I even have his addressi n Australia, I found it while investigating that polo 5 rumour last year. I haven't got around to writing to him yest, busy with change of job. It would be interesting to know if the guy who originally posted the info has more to share.
Regards
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Post by Stephen Neve on Jan 28, 2005 15:27:14 GMT
Nope. But then I don't need to have been. it's the usual format for badly made up internet missing-episode rumours. A "friend" happens to have come across a missing episode and the name of the episode reported is 90% correct. Heard it all before! I've been going to jumble sales for over 30 years and I've never met anyone who has just brought along something they have no intention of selling just for a laugh, so I don't know wha these "many people" you're talking about are! I just did! Oh, and there's no one with the name "Eulys Barker" listed on the electoral register or telephone directories anywhere in the UK. In fact, there's not a single person named "Eulys" listed! Could be one of the small handful not listed in either, but it certainly adds to the implausability! ;D Richard
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Post by Stephen Neve on Jan 28, 2005 15:30:37 GMT
Nope. But then I don't need to have been. it's the usual format for badly made up internet missing-episode rumours. A "friend" happens to have come across a missing episode and the name of the episode reported is 90% correct. Heard it all before! I've been going to jumble sales for over 30 years and I've never met anyone who has just brought along something they have no intention of selling just for a laugh, so I don't know wha these "many people" you're talking about are! I just did! Oh, and there's no one with the name "Eulys Barker" listed on the electoral register or telephone directories anywhere in the UK. In fact, there's not a single person named "Eulys" listed! Could be one of the small handful not listed in either, but it certainly adds to the implausability! ;D Richard "When will the daleks realise that everything dose not follow a pattern" Mavic Chen: Escape Switch Wake up Mr Bignell!
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Post by Wright Blan on Jan 29, 2005 3:44:29 GMT
Hi again, Sorry I didn't answer sooner, but I wanted to clarify the story that I had heard from my friend in New Zealand. Apparently he does have the canister for "The Roof Of The World," but sadly that is all. The film contents were of episode of a very common show titled "rawhide." Thanks Eulys Hmmmm....mabye this calls for a change of investigation. Instead of looking for cannisters of Doctor Who footage, mabye everybody should be on the lookout for cannisters marked "Rawhide"! Seriously, how much footage has been found that was marked as something else? I have a feeling it might have happened more that we might expect. Those metal cannesters cost money, you know. By the way, "Rawhide" isn't exactly common. It 's notable for featuring a young actor named Clint Eastwood.
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Post by Wright Blan on Jan 29, 2005 5:38:51 GMT
Sorry about double posting like this, but I just checked out a "Rawide" episode guide at TV Tome. There TEXTwasTEXT an episode titled "Incident at the Top of the World". Guess that's where all the confusion came from. Unless there was intentional misrepresentation, of course.
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