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Post by Tom Wollaert on Sept 4, 2019 6:41:03 GMT
Well damn look at that! I'm guessing this uses the original audio from the film print, with a bit of the audience reaction mixed in from the 16mm telerecording when Satan appears? I wonder if an off-air videotape from the uncut PBS airings might be a good source for the original soundtrack? Very excited about this. Looks and sounds better than I'd ever imaged experiencing. However, on the old worn-out version that I'm used to there is more audience response. On the reveal of the cruicifixes there is quite a bit of laughter that is not in this restoration. The laughter on Idle's devil is all there and better in balance, which is great.
Mr. Vanezis, any ideas on what's happened to the first part?
Also, I've heard that Fliegender Zirkus is not part of the boxset, is that true? Any plans on releasing it separately?
Thanks a million for this, really excited for November.
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Post by Paul Vanezis on Sept 5, 2019 18:33:59 GMT
Hi everyone.
Yes, the Cartoon Religions sketch is now complete.
We didn't go anywhere near the black and white kinescope. The quality was awful, sub VHS and running at 24fps.
We have as you can see used the original animation scene which also features the clean animation sound. We also have an original off-air from a PBS broadcast of the show, made before the cuts to the original tape.
As the sketch was NOT broadcast in the UK, we remixed the soundtrack to make the Terry Jones and Eric Idle dialogue audible. It now makes sense why the devil arrives on the scene.
We were very lucky to have discovered all the film for this episode which also includes additional material for the Crackpot Religions sketch, and more!
Paul
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Post by Ben Walker on Sept 5, 2019 22:04:26 GMT
Hi everyone. Yes, the Cartoon Religions sketch is now complete. We didn't go anywhere near the black and white kinescope. The quality was awful, sub VHS and running at 24fps. We have as you can see used the original animation scene which also features the clean animation sound. We also have an original off-air from a PBS broadcast of the show, made before the cuts to the original tape. As the sketch was NOT broadcast in the UK, we remixed the soundtrack to make the Terry Jones and Eric Idle dialogue audible. It now makes sense why the devil arrives on the scene. We were very lucky to have discovered all the film for this episode which also includes additional material for the Crackpot Religions sketch, and more! Paul Interesting to see that it wasn't originally broadcast in the UK! How did they manage that technically, while it still remained on the master long enough to get to the US tapes? I'm guessing that the Conquistador Coffee bits will have to come from the off-air tape?
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RWels
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Post by RWels on Sept 5, 2019 22:13:58 GMT
Hi everyone. Yes, the Cartoon Religions sketch is now complete. We didn't go anywhere near the black and white kinescope. The quality was awful, sub VHS and running at 24fps. We have as you can see used the original animation scene which also features the clean animation sound. We also have an original off-air from a PBS broadcast of the show, made before the cuts to the original tape. As the sketch was NOT broadcast in the UK, we remixed the soundtrack to make the Terry Jones and Eric Idle dialogue audible. It now makes sense why the devil arrives on the scene. We were very lucky to have discovered all the film for this episode which also includes additional material for the Crackpot Religions sketch, and more! Paul Interesting to see that it wasn't originally broadcast in the UK! How did they manage that technically, while it still remained on the master long enough to get to the US tapes? Yes that is surprising. I would have thought it went out on the first transmission. It's also on some telerecordings; the b/w copy came from a certain Steven S. I believe.
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Post by Paul Vanezis on Sept 5, 2019 22:21:00 GMT
Yes that is surprising. I would have thought it went out on the first transmission. It's also on some telerecordings; the b/w copy came from a certain Steven S. I believe. Well, the evidence is clear. It is a fascinating story, not just of what really happened, but the detective work to find the lost bits of tape... Paul
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Post by Ben Walker on Sept 5, 2019 22:22:52 GMT
Interesting to see that it wasn't originally broadcast in the UK! How did they manage that technically, while it still remained on the master long enough to get to the US tapes? Yes that is surprising. I would have thought it went out on the first transmission. It's also on some telerecordings; the b/w copy came from a certain Steven S. I believe. Weren't both telerecordings US copies though? Made from the PBS tapes? Shame that the original BBC 16mm T/R copies haven't turned up for the most important episodes of series 2 with missing content (Ep 6, 11 & 13) (Also, hey look at you, 2000 posts!)
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Post by Paul Vanezis on Sept 6, 2019 6:01:17 GMT
Weren't both telerecordings US copies though? Made from the PBS tapes? Shame that the original BBC 16mm T/R copies haven't turned up for the most important episodes of series 2 with missing content (Ep 6, 11 & 13) The kinescope for 2-11 is actually one of at least 3 copies I found of that episode, although as they are kinescopes they run at 24 frames and made from the NTSC tape that was distributed by Time Life, they aren't very good. A film recording wouldn't be much use because it would have been made on broadcast and neither Conquistador Coffee Campaign nor Cartoon Religions were broadcast intact in the UK. Not all film recordings that do survive have been that helpful. 'Sex and Violence' for example is a recording made AFTER the cut. But we do have 'The Nude Organist', 'Book at Bedtime' as complete film recording versions as well as many others. Paul
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Post by Ben Walker on Sept 6, 2019 7:46:59 GMT
Weren't both telerecordings US copies though? Made from the PBS tapes? Shame that the original BBC 16mm T/R copies haven't turned up for the most important episodes of series 2 with missing content (Ep 6, 11 & 13) The kinescope for 2-11 is actually one of at least 3 copies I found of that episode, although as they are kinescopes they run at 24 frames and made from the NTSC tape that was distributed by Time Life, they aren't very good. A film recording wouldn't be much use because it would have been made on broadcast and neither Conquistador Coffee Campaign nor Cartoon Religions were broadcast intact in the UK. Not all film recordings that do survive have been that helpful. 'Sex and Violence' for example is a recording made AFTER the cut. But we do have 'The Nude Organist', 'Book at Bedtime' as complete film recording versions as well as many others. Paul The Sex and Violence bit for Frosty’s number was luckily intact on the VT insert reel that was on YouTube a while back (complete with Cleese’s wonderful “ask for Dave” comment), but I guess it would be a bit difficult to smooth over the edit that’s currently in the master as it’s quite abrupt. Has anything better turned up for the Undertakers than what’s currently available?
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RWels
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Post by RWels on Sept 6, 2019 20:20:53 GMT
Yes that is surprising. I would have thought it went out on the first transmission. It's also on some telerecordings; the b/w copy came from a certain Steven S. I believe. Well, the evidence is clear. It is a fascinating story, not just of what really happened, but the detective work to find the lost bits of tape... Paul It must have also still existed without laughter then, for you to amplify that audio. I never fully heard what they were saying until now. In some ways, isn't this creating a version which never existed? (Not that I mind in this case...)
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Post by Paul Vanezis on Sept 7, 2019 8:49:18 GMT
Well,
It depends which way you look at it. The version that has been seen as kinescopes and off-airs would have been broadcast intact if not for two key interventions.
At the end of the day, the episode was though not intended to be seen in that form and the sound mix, which was done live during the studio recording makes the animation dialogue almost inaudible.
Regarding 'Sex and Violence', the right caption card was indeed spliced on the end of the tape, so we have used that. But it's an alternative take of the audio with less audience laughter. The original audio doesn't exist in the BBC archive so we have had to revert to the only surviving audio recording, made by a colleague of mine, the late Ed Doolan.
Paul
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Post by martinogorman on Sept 9, 2019 15:32:14 GMT
This is VERY interesting. Looks like this box set and Lord Pixley’s books will destroy a few long-standing myths in that case.
Nice to hear the audio on the Satan Animation cleaned up - a few Python animations have their jokes stepped on by some dodgy audio mixing on the day (which probably wasn’t helped by Gilliam’s notoriously lo-fi approach to recording).
For example, the cartoon that leads into “Timmy Williams Coffee Time” (Series 2, Show 6) ends with the animated woman saying “Voila! A meal fit for a - “.
…Which is either a joke I don’t get, or the film audio was dipped too soon. As it’s part of a sequence that cuts back and forth between studio and film in quick succession, I’m favouring the latter. Especially as the cut-out mouth keeps moving.
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Post by Ben Walker on Sept 11, 2019 2:26:23 GMT
Well here's an idea of what's in store for Series 1: www.amazon.co.uk/Monty-Pythons-Flying-Circus-Complete/dp/B07XN4BKQC/Sex and Violence: reinstated content, studio outtakes Full Frontal Nudity: studio outtakes The Ant, an Introduction: studio outtakes Untitled: extended Ron Obvious filmed material and clean end titles footage Shame the clipped "it was better than the sandwiches" line wasn't tagged onto the end of episode 5! I hope the studio outtakes will be presented as-is, I quite like all of the studio chatter during the bits with no video signal.
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Post by David Huggins on Oct 4, 2019 11:02:57 GMT
Amazing restoration work! Congratulations to all involved - can't wait to see the box set.
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Post by Paul Vanezis on Oct 6, 2019 10:14:25 GMT
Hi all,
Just a small update. There has been speculation elsewhere that the cut studio sketches from series 3 episode 10 have been found and included on the release.
Unfortunately we have found no intact audience studio recording of any episode and certainly nothing from that show. There are two insert tapes surviving from series 3, episode 9 and episode 13.
Once the full roster of extras has been announced, I'll go into a bit more detail here and in the thread on the General page, as there is a lot more rediscovered material included on the release that in conjunction with the restored episodes, paints a clearer picture of the changes that were made to series 3 at the request of the BBC. The episodes most affected are eps 10, 12 and 13.
Paul
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RWels
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Post by RWels on Oct 7, 2019 10:24:40 GMT
Is it true that the Montreux episode won't be included?
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