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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2018 10:04:17 GMT
Just wondered what everyone's thoughts are on how much of a delaying process the rumours may brought to the overseas search and recoveries since they started as whispers in 2011, and turned into shouting with the mid-2013 omnirumour.
Has this surge of online attention onto an obviously sensitive and secretive operation slowed things down (it's now almost 5 years since the last reveals). Did something harmful happen the moment the 'news' broke? More seriously, how close do we think these rumours might have come to derailing everything, so that nothing can ever be returned to the UK from abroad?
I wonder, had nothing been whispered in the first place, had everybody kept quiet, would we by now be looking at maybe a couple more DVDs of recovered stories on our shelves?
I'm thinking back to the Jos theft of WOF 3 and something else, plus the implications hinted at previously that if someone who is in possession of missing material reads these rumours online and then understands how valuable their items are, they may then delay the negotiating process by raising the bartering level even higher.
I'm just glad that the professional episode hunters keep their cards close to their chest and say nothing until an offical annoucement. The right way to do it.
Thoughts please...
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Post by George D on Jul 15, 2018 12:52:35 GMT
These are just thoughts.
1. No one knows what is going on in the mind of phil morris.
2. The omni rumor occurred much later than when he received things.
3. one theory was that pm was with holding films because of the omni rumor. I'm not going to comment on that. However I still wonder if pm likes the spotlight.
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Post by Greg H on Jul 15, 2018 18:23:36 GMT
My thoughts.
Fans angrily calling overseas stations and screaming at the top of their voices will possibly have stopped a thing or two from coming back. If you are told that an old film can is priceless beyond all imagining etc, the average joe might hang onto it rather than send it back gratis.
Other than that, all of the fan frenzy, wailing, speculating, arguing, parsing, name calling, theorising etc will have had exactly ZERO effect on anything with the exception of their own blood pressure. The idea that fans will somehow effect the outcome of missing episodes by arguing on forums about an omnirumour or similar is frankly bizarre.
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Post by tom rogers on Jul 15, 2018 18:35:55 GMT
I'm thinking back to the Jos theft of WOF 3 and something else, plus the implications hinted at previously that if someone who is in possession of missing material reads these rumours online and then understands how valuable their items are, they may then delay the negotiating process by raising the bartering level even higher. I think that may very well be true, but there are also other possibilities. There are collectors who, believe it or not, are not that interested in obtaining financial or other compensation for items they hold. Some cherish their anonymity and worry that disclosing what they hold would destroy their invisibility. The hysteria and, yes, downright animosity that some posters on this and other sites have at times exhibited towards those who might hold such items would be enough to spook anyone who was thinking of possibly providing access to their treasures. I know a fellow who posseses a significant manuscript by a well-known author that is completely unknown to biographers and bibliographers of said author. The only reason I know this is that he approached me privately and in confidence to authenticate it (which I did, and it is authentic). However, this fellow, in an anonymous post to someone else on a chat, accidentally let slip the mere possible existence of said manuscript (no details other than the author's name). The news spread like a wildfire. The result was a major blow-up on a chat site dedicated to said author, threatening messages posted concerning this poor anonymous fellow's "intentions", and rampant speculation about the best way to discover his identity and to force him to reveal what he has. All this did was ensure that the fellow was properly spooked and will NEVER disclose what he has. His original intent was to offer it gratis to the world for our enjoyment, and now all I can do is to try to convnce him to make sure his heirs don't pitch it out with the trash when he passes. Would it have been better had the Who omni-rumour never happened? Well, it is water under the bridge, now. It certainly does not appear to have helped things, so at best it seems to be harmless, but at worst it might very well have made things more difficult.
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Post by Robert Lia on Jul 15, 2018 18:57:14 GMT
The Omini rumor got way out of hand and as a result may have damaged chances at future recovery's. Fans calling TV stations around the world may have simply given the employees at these TV stations that they have something valuable tat could be sold for profit. Especially if they are in a third world country.
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Post by cjones on Jul 15, 2018 19:29:06 GMT
FWIW, I think it does DW fans too much honour to say the omnirumour negatively influenced anything - it's a fan thing, and unknown outside fan circles. I can see the point made a couple of times upthread regarding the possibility of employees at TV stations nabbing episodes from their storerooms as a result of enquiries made by fans, however.
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Post by Jaspal Cheema on Jul 15, 2018 19:52:39 GMT
FWIW, I think it does DW fans too much honour to say the omnirumour negatively influenced anything - it's a fan thing, and unknown outside fan circles. I can see the point made a couple of times upthread regarding the possibility of employees at TV stations nabbing episodes from their storerooms as a result of enquiries made by fans, however. Was the theft of WOF 3 a result of the omnirumour?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 15, 2018 20:26:19 GMT
FWIW, I think it does DW fans too much honour to say the omnirumour negatively influenced anything - it's a fan thing, and unknown outside fan circles. I can see the point made a couple of times upthread regarding the possibility of employees at TV stations nabbing episodes from their storerooms as a result of enquiries made by fans, however. Was the theft of WOF 3 a result of the omnirumour? No, it definitely happened before, as most believe the episodes were located well before 2013, and that the theft subsequently took place when PM returned to the UK after the discovery. However, it was an example of someone untrustworthy knowing where these missing episodes are located. Although the omni-rumour wasn't responsible in this instance, I can see from this how it potential might have been the catalyst for more thefts. I can understand now why secrecy has been the key and why the fans have been kept out of the loop. It's like nothing further has been recovered, really, the many doubts expressed online over any further releases seem to confirm this. And that's how the atmosphere should remain until a future announcement. It's safer that way.
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Post by samnurden on Jul 15, 2018 22:56:13 GMT
These rumours spring up all the time, so it seems really unlikely. If the semi-confirmed rumour that Web, Enemy and Marco were back, (Aka M.E.W, which bear in mind, made headlines. The BBC sort of commented and danced around it at the time.) didn't hinder two of them showing up, I don't think the omnirumour would do much either.
You could put forward the idea that it's the reason why Marco Polo never showed up with the other two, I guess, but I don't think so. It was probably either that it was never at the BBC at all, and wires got crossed somewhere, or they thought they had it but something happened. Anyway, I don't think rumors hinder things, too many false ones amongst potential gold dust (the real ones) which stop anything negative like that from coming about like that.
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Post by Dan S on Jul 16, 2018 0:38:04 GMT
I'm just glad that the professional episode hunters keep their cards close to their chest and say nothing until an offical annoucement. The right way to do it. But the omnirumour was caused by Philip Morris keeping his cards close to his chest.
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Post by Robert Lia on Jul 16, 2018 2:24:42 GMT
The Omni rumor was blown out of proportion with all these so called fans who had "inside knowledge" from there "trusted sources" at the BBC and other places and it went from there. Heck at one time those "in the know" reported that "multiple restoration teams" were working on the episodes because the main restoration team was over loaded.
Don't get me wrong many believed with there hearts that they thought they were posting true information but there was also an element of fans who wanted to "spool people up" notably over at Outpost Gallifrey / Gallifrey Base.
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Post by zaqwilson on Jul 16, 2018 15:05:32 GMT
No.
The Omni Rumor has not likely done anything negative to the process. It did raise awareness of ME's, which is necessary to help prevent things from being binned when people are not aware of their status. Rumors and speculation have little to no effect on the reality. As stated before, outside of fan circles the Omni rumor did not really circulate and few to none cared. In the circles these rumor spread, ME's are already well known and sought after. Outside these circles--virtually nothing.
Honestly we know little to nothing of what is actually going on. The chase for WOF 3, tracking paperwork, and hopes for a chance encounter with something forgotten may be it. On the other hand, things may not be in the archive, but are no longer MIA (citing the statement by PM that he would only release complete stories). There may be long, protracted negotiations with collectors of multiple episodes. We simply don't know. Speculation does no real harm. Rumors just bate those who are willing, who want to believe.
There will be more, but what, how many and when is anybody's guess.
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Post by Charles Daniels on Jul 17, 2018 6:24:25 GMT
The only thing that gives me great pause is this conversation I had with this fan who had called various tv stations in Ethopia and Nigeria. Not only that he was PROUD that he had done it. PROUD that he was "uncovering the truth"
When I mentioned that this was a pretty dumb idea, as, if he kept calling these places and asking about Dr Who they might have second thoughts if they came across something; or simply that if someone more experienced at retrieving missing material happened to contact them down the road they might be written off as another nutter rambling about Doctor Who -- the guy just doubled down and told me he was going to email or call every station in Africa and then move on to Asia.
So... yeah I'm worried.
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Post by Robert Lia on Jul 17, 2018 6:55:10 GMT
The road to hell is paved with good intentions
Fortunately I think its safe to say Phil beat him to it
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Post by Stephen Neve on Jul 17, 2018 16:58:58 GMT
The Omini rumor got way out of hand and as a result may have damaged chances at future recovery's. Fans calling TV stations around the world may have simply given the employees at these TV stations that they have something valuable tat could be sold for profit. Especially if they are in a third world country. Nonsense!. Rubbish rumours don't jepordize recoveries. The only way the Omini Rumour could jepordize anything if there is some truth to it. Is there any evidence fans called TV stations. The only thing the Omini has damaged is friendships on forums. The nothing has been found brigade vs the source kings, what a mess. Its reminds me of all this brexit fiasco of Remainers v Leavers with each side insisting they are correct.
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