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Post by John G on Feb 19, 2006 10:24:08 GMT
Just to reiterate.
Its damn peculiar that THE event of the 20th Century has been treated in this way with regards to the archive.
We have a complete days recording of the 1966/70 elections for heaven sake !
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Post by Gary on Feb 19, 2006 10:29:22 GMT
I aggree with you John,Could someone list what footage is used in this programme and post it on here?I dont have BBC4.Thanks.
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Post by Andy Henderson on Feb 19, 2006 12:05:57 GMT
"Its damn peculiar that THE event of the 20th Century has been treated in this way with regards to the archive."
There may have been a good reason for this. It is easy with hindsight to ask questions, but it could have been anything from union problems to a technical issue. All efforts might have been on getting the Goonhilly feed recorded and distributed to the rest of Europe.
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Post by Andrew Doherty on Feb 19, 2006 15:23:50 GMT
I was given to understand that the BBC television studio coverage of the Apollo 11 'lead up' to the landing event was recorded on video tape FOR PRESERVATION. However, someone had confused the 'serial numbers' on the video tape labels with those of some other video tapes, which were to be wiped and used again. Consequently, the wrong tapes were wiped.
In my opinion, this very grim explanation would make sense as to why tapes were 'not kept'. Of course, someone was bound to find out sooner or later when making an anniversary programme about the event.
On a happier note, it would seem there were individuals who did keep a recording or recordings of the U.K. coverage of the event.
I shall, certainly, be viewing the BBC 4 programme to discover just what was found and the quality of the recordings.
Yours,
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Post by Andy Henderson on Feb 19, 2006 16:26:56 GMT
Quite a few people used standard 8mm to film off the tv screen. I recently found a clip with (by co-incidence with Patrick Moore) plus a clip from some other science fiction series. Only a few seconds though. There are a large number of people who took snaps from the tv screen (judging by the people who've mentionedd this to me). Then we have the audio recording, which exists complete with the Strauss music at the start.
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Post by Laurence Piper on Feb 20, 2006 10:22:40 GMT
"Its damn peculiar that THE event of the 20th Century has been treated in this way with regards to the archive." There may have been a good reason for this. It is easy with hindsight to ask questions, but it could have been anything from union problems to a technical issue. All efforts might have been on getting the Goonhilly feed recorded and distributed to the rest of Europe. Somehow though, this seems a very unsatisfactory excuse. After all, as someone else above said, they managed to keep other important events such as election coverage etc. without mishaps. THE most important event of the 20th century seems to have been treated very shoddily though. As Andrew Doherty above says, the possibility of a mix-up occurring with the tapes seems more plausible. However, that doesn't account for ITV coverage of the event - does anyone know exactly how much of THEIR coverage survives (as some degree of compensation for the severe lack of BBC master material)?
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Post by Andy Henderson on Feb 20, 2006 20:19:44 GMT
Y'know a constant irritation to me on this site and many other websites are people constantly bemoaning how careless the BBC were. It is always easy (with hindsight) to criticize. Harder to justify. The BBC were running an efficient television factory. In business conditions, you do not usually think of what might happen 40 years later, let alone budget for it. Let's face it, the majority of 1960s b/w programmes are curios. With few exceptions, the public aren't interested. I haven't seen queues of people asking in 'Virgin Megastore' for the complete 'Z-Cars' either. Of course the fans would tell you how marvelous these old programmes are, but they are in a tiny minority. Then there is the social value point. Granted, some pro grammes are interesting, but for every one, there are ten or twenty pedestrian efforts as interchangeable as a modern episode of 'Holby City' or 'The Bill'. I think we are lucky that we do have as much as we do. You cannot change the past, but instead of moaning, you can still get off your backside and do some missing television digging.
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Post by John G on Feb 20, 2006 21:29:09 GMT
Andy with respect we are not talking about Z Cars , but possibly the unique scientific event of the 20 century, perhaps in the history of mankind?
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Post by Andrew Doherty on Feb 20, 2006 22:02:07 GMT
As implied in my previous posting, I am of the opinion that we shall be viewing some very interesting, formerly missing, Apollo 11 footage.
(Just a note more. I have, recently, given a lead about the possible existence of some London Palladium Shows. Though, it must be stated that my lead is now ten years old.)
So, again, on an optimistic note, I think viewing this new programme on the Apollo 11 coverage will be worth watching.
Yours,
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Post by Gary on Feb 21, 2006 0:13:54 GMT
Y'know a constant irritation to me on this site and many other websites are people constantly bemoaning how careless the BBC were. It is always easy (with hindsight) to criticize. Harder to justify. The BBC were running an efficient television factory. In business conditions, you do not usually think of what might happen 40 years later, let alone budget for it. Let's face it, the majority of 1960s b/w programmes are curios. With few exceptions, the public aren't interested. I haven't seen queues of people asking in 'Virgin Megastore' for the complete 'Z-Cars' either. Of course the fans would tell you how marvelous these old programmes are, but they are in a tiny minority. Then there is the social value point. Granted, some pro grammes are interesting, but for every one, there are ten or twenty pedestrian efforts as interchangeable as a modern episode of 'Holby City' or 'The Bill'. I think we are lucky that we do have as much as we do. You cannot change the past, but instead of moaning, you can still get off your backside and do some missing television digging. There speaks the voice of the BBC.No wonder so many programmes are gone with an attitude like that.
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Post by Laurence Piper on Feb 21, 2006 0:33:33 GMT
Andy with respect we are not talking about Z Cars , but possibly the unique scientific event of the 20 century, perhaps in the history of mankind? Exactly, John. People can say what they like about the relative merits of other missing programming but there can be no excuse for this one - whatever the reason.
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Post by Paul Vanezis on Feb 21, 2006 12:01:09 GMT
[Exactly, John. People can say what they like about the relative merits of other missing programming but there can be no excuse for this one - whatever the reason. I think the general point Andy is trying to make is that it is easy to criticise in hindsight. It was a long time ago and the situation has changed. It's like accusing a current head of state for a 40 year old war crime (perhaps a rather tasteless comparison but you get my meaning). But anyway, yes there is some great fooage which hasn't been seen before, some of it from the Space Studio, although not a great deal. The programme is mainly in colour and now goes out on Tuesday 28th at 1 in the morning. It's on the Monday schedule which is online now. www.bbc.co.uk/bbcfour/listings/week/printable.shtmlCheers, Paul
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Post by B Thomas on Feb 21, 2006 12:46:27 GMT
Hiya Paul. Did you have any luck with whatever became of the old NZ National Film Library ? Then again, I think the footage I saw was B&W (and you mentioned colour material...)
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Post by Paul Vanezis on Feb 21, 2006 16:35:35 GMT
Hiya Paul. Did you have any luck with whatever became of the old NZ National Film Library ? Then again, I think the footage I saw was B&W (and you mentioned colour material...) Hiya. I'm afraid time is far too short for me to track down anything in a foreign archive this side of my broadcast. I'm in an edit suite as we speak attempting to complete this monster! If you saw black and white footage, in all likelihood it was a black and white film recording which is what was typically done as a PasB at the time. When I get this project out of the way I'll chase it up. If you have any details of where you saw it and a date, that would be useful. Cheers, Paul
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Post by Andy Henderson on Feb 22, 2006 0:03:17 GMT
All very melodramatic, some of these replies. No excuse for junking the moon landing? It isn't junked as you know, just the studio links. Perhaps these people prefer watching James Burke to Neil Armstrong? The actual handling of this is fairly dry, with Burke adding little to the feed because the astronauts spoke through most of it. The total effect is downplaying to the audience. Unlike the ITV variety party. Going back to the 'attitude like that' comment, well, generally, yeah you can read into that comment any way you want, but at least I did go out of my way to find missing television as has Paul, which is better than achieving nothing by moaning about the obvious on here. When you go through enough old television, you do realise that 'old' does not always equate with quality. There was rubbish then as now.
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